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Why experience is more valuable than certs

Discussion in 'Employment & Jobs' started by kevicho, Mar 6, 2009.

  1. kevicho

    kevicho Gigabyte Poster

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    Im not knocking certs, they are great for progressing a career (they have helped mine a LOT), but I just wanted to point out over the last few days ive gotten to spend some time with someone near to completion of there CCIE, and weve gone through procurve switch management, and lots of networking related topics and passed on a some tips which have meant I have learned something.

    All this for free as well :) in fact I was actually paid to receive this knowledge, so for all those out there looking for there first IT role, this is what you have to look forward too, communicating with peers is a great tool for learning, and 90% of true knowledge is not just through the microsoft books, its comes from actually walking the walk.

    For those currently working in IT, hopefully you are in the same position, if not get involved with some local groups (such as the BCS).

    Back to work, am working in on project for a new AV rollout, tis much better than lugging computers around lol.

    Hope this inspires someone to work hard to move up in IT.
     
    Certifications: A+, Net+, MCSA Server 2003, 2008, Windows XP & 7 , ITIL V3 Foundation
    WIP: CCNA Renewal
  2. Bluerinse
    Honorary Member

    Bluerinse Exabyte Poster

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    Very valid point mate, thanks for sharing 8)
     
    Certifications: C&G Electronics - MCSA (W2K) MCSE (W2K)
  3. Crito

    Crito Banned

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    Imported labor from India can do the same job a lot cheaper.
     
    Certifications: A few
    WIP: none
  4. onoski

    onoski Terabyte Poster

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    You'd be better off carrying your bitter spewing slant some where else. Shame on you.
     
    Certifications: MCSE: 2003, MCSA: 2003 Messaging, MCP, HNC BIT, ITIL Fdn V3, SDI Fdn, VCP 4 & VCP 5
    WIP: MCTS:70-236, PowerShell
  5. Bluerinse
    Honorary Member

    Bluerinse Exabyte Poster

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    Ok guys chill.

    You having a bad day Crito?
     
    Certifications: C&G Electronics - MCSA (W2K) MCSE (W2K)
  6. wagnerk
    Highly Decorated Member Award

    wagnerk aka kitkatninja Moderator

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    That's right, hence why there is a growing trend of IT managers disregarding higher level certs if the experience doesn't reflect them :)

    -ken
     
    Certifications: CITP, PGCert, BSc, HNC, LCGI, PTLLS, MCT, MCITP, MCTS, MCSE, MCSA:M, MCSA, MCDST, MCP, MTA, MCAS, MOS (Master), A+, N+, S+, ACA, VCA, etc... & 2nd Degree Black Belt
    WIP: PGDip
  7. UKDarkstar
    Honorary Member

    UKDarkstar Terabyte Poster

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    It's a mix of having experience and certs. I think the latter validates expereince but only if the employer and employee truly understand the purpose of the cert and it's requirements.

    It's one of the reasons why, at the Job Night event I'm organising, we have a speaker on the topic of Experience v. Certification :)
     
    Certifications: BA (Hons), MBCS, CITP, MInstLM, ITIL v3 Fdn, PTLLS, CELTA
    WIP: CMALT (about to submit), DTLLS (on hold until 2012)
  8. hippy

    hippy Kilobyte Poster

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    I would agree with all this but then again i would also like job titles to match responsibilites. I would love Title, experience and certs to all be the same level. I know there are some places that do not even look at your experience and just want your certs to be a certain level.

    e.g. Kevicho i remember you changed job to a deputy manager of some description. Taking your AV rollout example. I have rolled out Symantec MultiTier Protection at my work place for our 5 uk sites, 1 european and on the road sales force people. Yet im still a First Line Support Engineer.
     
  9. Sparky
    Highly Decorated Member Award

    Sparky Zettabyte Poster Moderator

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    If the experience is solid then the certs should be fairly straight forward. Always good to have the certs to back up the experience.
     
    Certifications: MSc MCSE MCSA:M MCSA:S MCITP:EA MCTS(x5) Security+ Network+ A+
    WIP: Exchange 2007\2010
  10. fatp

    fatp Byte Poster

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    I think this is true.

    The title of this thread sums it all up.

    no cert or academic qualification can guarantee that first elusive job job in IT. Its all about the experience!

    But... how do you get that first big break? try, try and try harder. I had about 12 interviews and got knocked back in all of em as others had experience and I didnt. You simple have to persevere throught it, as you will get a break if you try hard enough. There would be no such thing as entry level jobs (meaning without experience) e.g. 1st line / desktop jobs if all employers wanted experienced IT pro's.
     
    Certifications: Comp Sci BSc, NVQ 2 & 3 IT Professional
    WIP: Comptia A+, Network+
  11. kevicho

    kevicho Gigabyte Poster

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    Hi, thanks for the reply.

    I agree that some companies the IT is upside down, 1st line support by definition shouldnt be doing AV rollouts to that scale, unless they are under supervision and are being trained up for future greatness, which I hope is the case for you.
    However no 2 companies IT departments are the same, in the past my job title was Desktop support, yet I was supporting a win2k server cluster, blackberry server, exchange, SQL and more so yeah job titles arent always what make the role, and I think that most IT pros will know that this is the case, whats important on a CV is the experience and if possible the relevant certification to back it up.

    I think part of the reason my career is moving up so to speak in terms of job titles, is that over the past several months I have spent money on improving my work attire and have worked on soft skills, so just being a good techy is not enough these days, in fact crito is right, there is probably cheaper indian labour out there, however thats why you need to use other things at your disposal, such as the fact you will naturally be more accepted in your own culture, the language and accent barrier isnt there, no longer can geeks be just geeks, we have to get out there and show IT is valuable to the business we work for.
     
    Certifications: A+, Net+, MCSA Server 2003, 2008, Windows XP & 7 , ITIL V3 Foundation
    WIP: CCNA Renewal
  12. kevicho

    kevicho Gigabyte Poster

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    Volunteer (to do IT work for local charities for example)
    Learn to sell yourself
    use Networking methods to your advantage (ie linkedin, facebook)
    Join a society
    Do night classes (great way to make contacts)
    Become well known and liked on IT forums or on a forum of a company you would like a chance with (ie an ISP)
    Send letters to companies enquiring of vacancies or possible placement or volunteer opportunities

    Sometimes its not what you know its who you know ;)

    ISPs are constantly having staff turnover, they dont require great skill for the most part and will give you something IT and communications related to put on your CV, the job i wouldnt do any more, but its a foot in the door.
     
    Certifications: A+, Net+, MCSA Server 2003, 2008, Windows XP & 7 , ITIL V3 Foundation
    WIP: CCNA Renewal

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