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To all the negative nonbelivers...

Discussion in 'Employment & Jobs' started by Nikk, Mar 30, 2008.

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  1. Nikk

    Nikk New Member

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    To All The Negative Members, Who Rubbished My Last Post..
    A few months ago, I posted on here explaining that I have no IT commercial experience and I had completed my CCNA and was midway through my CCSP.

    heres the post http://www.certforums.co.uk/forums/showthread.php?t=20087&goto=newpost

    A lot of you basically said I was wasting my time and should step back and do a Network + cert and take a lower level job in a call center or something to build up my experience.

    Well, I have been back in the UK for 2 months trying to find work, which I have been more than successful. I was offered the position of field service engineer for the biggest digital media company in EU which I turned down because I now work for a UK car manufactuer in the Midlands as a Senior Network Analyst.

    I never sold myself short; I had clear goals from the beginning. Because I had past management experience and conducted myself well at the interview they were willing to give me a start. As they said, ‘we can bring you up to speed with technology; most importantly we need a team player’

    So I didn’t waste my time or effort and it went exactly as planned, I didn’t walk into any lampposts.

    How I did it:
    Most importantly craft a perfect CV,playing on your strengths and past achievements. I cannot stress this enough, DO NOT post it out untill you are 100% happy, an old CV can circulate for months or even years.
    Register with as many job sites as possible.
    Check for new positions first thing in the morning while they are still fresh and do this every day.
    If it’s a role your really keen on call them up and talk to them instead of just emailing them.
    keep updating your profile on the job sites so you stay on top.
    Apply for as many jobs as possible, even if you think they are above your skill set. They may be struggling to fill the role or willing to train you up to their spec.
    If you get an interview, make sure you gem up on the company first. Make sure you know what the role will entail and study it at least 24 hrs before so you can answer questions and do ask questions at the interview.

    I wish you success, don't be discouraged by other posters who profess they are experts in the IT field and know everything about the IT industry. If they were truly so good, they wouldn't have time to post on boards like this, they would be out there in the thick of it.
     
    Certifications: CCNA,SNPA,SND,Cisco Firewall Specialist
    WIP: CCSP
  2. zebulebu

    zebulebu Terabyte Poster

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    Sigh.

    Congratulations and all that.

    From someone who works in the industry, has done for years and did it the real way - yet still somehow has time to post on this board.

    See you in a few months when your lack of experience in supporting real networks comes home to roost. Alternatively, if you manage to bull**** your way through it for a couple of years, you may just get lucky.

    You heard it here on this post first noobs. Loads of certs and no experience is DEFINITELY the way to go.
     
    Certifications: A few
    WIP: None - f*** 'em
  3. greenbrucelee
    Highly Decorated Member Award

    greenbrucelee Zettabyte Poster

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    Well done Nikk thats great news :)

    Its not that people were rubbishing your last post, its because the majority of people without any experience and have certs have to start at the bottom in an entry level post.

    If you do a search on here you will find plenty of posts from people saying I have my CCNA or MCSE and no one will give me job and thats because they are over certified for their experience level.

    You have beaten the trend so well done on that but most people are not that lucky.

    Just to add most people who responded to your last post are experts in their field and have many years experience in what they are doing so they will infact know more than you or I as to how the industry works.
     
    Certifications: A+, N+, MCDST, Security+, 70-270
    WIP: 70-620 or 70-680?
  4. Sparky
    Highly Decorated Member Award

    Sparky Zettabyte Poster Moderator

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    What a load of crap. :dry
     
    Certifications: MSc MCSE MCSA:M MCSA:S MCITP:EA MCTS(x5) Security+ Network+ A+
    WIP: Exchange 2007\2010
  5. Nikk

    Nikk New Member

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    here comes the barrage of slagging off, why is this board so negative and unfriendly??

    I didn't bull**** my way in and I resent the implication. I told them the truth.
     
    Certifications: CCNA,SNPA,SND,Cisco Firewall Specialist
    WIP: CCSP
  6. Sparky
    Highly Decorated Member Award

    Sparky Zettabyte Poster Moderator

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    You just slagged us off though? 8)
     
    Certifications: MSc MCSE MCSA:M MCSA:S MCITP:EA MCTS(x5) Security+ Network+ A+
    WIP: Exchange 2007\2010
  7. dmarsh

    dmarsh Terabyte Poster

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    Believe it or not after 15+ years of hard work and study I now get a little free time and wanted to 'give something back', when people make comments like that I begin to think I'm wasting my time and should well be doing other stuff...

    I don't always take the tough line that some other people do but I can see why they do it, Its possible to blag your way through life, ever seen the film 'Catch Me If You Can' ? If people can blag being a doctor then of course they can blag an IT job, does that make it a good course of action ?

    Believe me when I say there are already more than enough hangers on adding no value and a lot of fud and general misinformation into the world of IT. The last thing we need is any more !

    I'm all for giving people a break and perhaps you deserve a trail as a junior network admin, if you manage to impress on paper and in an interview. 'Senior Network Analyst' on the strength of no experience? I would say is probably a little irresponsible at best, hope you don't put any car plants out of action for 24 hours when you misconfigure something... because you could rack up your years wages in $$$ in minutes...
     
    Certifications: CITP, BSc, HND, SCJP, SCJD, SCWCD, SCBCD, SCEA, N+, Sec+, Proj+, Server+, Linux+, MCTS, MCPD, MCSA, MCITP, CCDH
  8. Nikk

    Nikk New Member

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    sorry, i shouldn't of said that but it does seem there are more than an average amount of posters on here who love to flame people for trying to move forward in life.

    look at the very first post I received in this thread

    BTW thanks greenbrucelee
     
    Certifications: CCNA,SNPA,SND,Cisco Firewall Specialist
    WIP: CCSP
  9. tripwire45
    Honorary Member

    tripwire45 Zettabyte Poster

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    Nikk, I'd have to go over your prior thread to see the specific content, but as far as how you started this thread, you seemed to be spoiling for a fight. Your approach could have been more informative and enlightening if you'd removed the "attitude" from it.

    For the most part, this is a very friendly and helpful board. If you were given advice, it was given in good faith. If you "beat the odds", good on you. You seem like a very determined and goal oriented person and I'm glad your method is working for you. Also, thanks for sharing what works for you. It might help someone else.

    However, as I mentioned before, you could have communicated all of your helpful information without copping a bad attitude. So far, as far as this thread is concerned, most of the "unfriendly" comments that have been posted have been made by you.

    As far as the level of IT proficiency represented on this board, it runs the full range from total newbie to seasoned IT professional. Your statement that professionals wouldn't post on this board but would instead be "out in the thick of it" is untrue. The vast majority of IT professionals I know maintain a wealth of networking (human, that is) contacts, both on the Internet and through other means. *No one * "knows it all, but a smart person knows where to go to do research and ask for help. CF happens to be one of those places.

    If you are willing to be a *positive* contributing member of this board (regardless of whether you believe you have been treated fairly or not), your comments and participation are welcome. If your main point in posting here is to tell us how unfriendly we are, I'm sure you could find some other board on the Internet that would better meet your needs.

    Any further flaming or personality bashing *by anyone* will result in this thread being locked and the user's account receiving an infraction. No more games.

    -Trip
     
    Certifications: A+ and Network+
  10. Sparky
    Highly Decorated Member Award

    Sparky Zettabyte Poster Moderator

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    Seriously, congrats on the job. :thumbleft

    However posting a thread to basically say “get it right up yeee!” as some of my Scottish friends would say isn’t exactly nice. :biggrin
     
    Certifications: MSc MCSE MCSA:M MCSA:S MCITP:EA MCTS(x5) Security+ Network+ A+
    WIP: Exchange 2007\2010
  11. Modey

    Modey Terabyte Poster

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    There is an old saying ... "you reap what you sow"
     
    Certifications: A+, N+, MCP, MCDST, MCSA 2K3, MCTS, MOS, MTA, MCT, MCITP:EDST7, MCSA W7, Citrix CCA, ITIL Foundation
    WIP: Nada
  12. Nikk

    Nikk New Member

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    I am glad you agree that flaming is not good, I haven't flamed anyone personally. I just wanted to let other "newbies" know that there is hope and it can be done, I am living proof and not to be discouraged by others. If you have a goal just go for it. Being accused of bull****ting my way in or busll****ting my way through a couple of years or even bringing a car plant a standstill is hardly friendly nor helpful advice.
     
    Certifications: CCNA,SNPA,SND,Cisco Firewall Specialist
    WIP: CCSP
  13. wagnerk
    Highly Decorated Member Award

    wagnerk aka kitkatninja Moderator

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    That's true, this comes under the "soft skills" umbrella of skills which alot of IT Professional's need to either get or improve :)

    Congrats on the job, btw

    -Ken
     
    Certifications: CITP, PGCert, BSc, HNC, LCGI, PTLLS, MCT, MCITP, MCTS, MCSE, MCSA:M, MCSA, MCDST, MCP, MTA, MCAS, MOS (Master), A+, N+, S+, ACA, VCA, etc... & 2nd Degree Black Belt
    WIP: PGDip
  14. dmarsh

    dmarsh Terabyte Poster

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    Well if you're as good as you say you have little to fear right ?

    The point I was making is 'Senior Network Engineer' should mean something, its not just a pay grade or a management position. I don't work in networking or infrastructure so I might be wrong, but to me this would mean something like the following :-

    1. You know more about your chosen profession than all the people that report to you, you are capable of helping them solve their problems as well as more difficult ones that they cannot solve.

    2. You are capable of working unassisted and making difficult decisions on your own.

    3. You bring together years of experience and know how, that allow you to make the 'right decisions' either instinctively or by logical deduction. (Ever heard the phase 'Expert Systems' ? Ever wondered why people with experience make better decisions ?)

    If you can say yes to these questions then you are indeed a senior engineer, if you need to rely on your peers and even juniors on a regular basis then I would say you are not...
     
    Certifications: CITP, BSc, HND, SCJP, SCJD, SCWCD, SCBCD, SCEA, N+, Sec+, Proj+, Server+, Linux+, MCTS, MCPD, MCSA, MCITP, CCDH
  15. Rob1234

    Rob1234 Megabyte Poster

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    Congratulations on the job I know exactly what you are saying about people saying no experience then do certain certs and nothing else it really annoys me, you have proved that is not always correct and I also know other people have done what you have done.

    I use this forum regularly and unfortunately I see people being told time and time again to do this cert. and that cert, maybe you could stay around and offer your experience and advice to other new members so that they might achieve the same as you and not be put off by what they are told.

    (This is just my opinion please do not reply telling me why I am wrong and you are right this is just how I feel, no flaming needed)
     
    Certifications: A few.
  16. Mitzs
    Honorary Member

    Mitzs Ducktape Goddess

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    First let me say a big congrats to you, because you have beaten the odds no matter what you think. I wish you all the best and really hope it works out for you. However, please do not take the additude you have here into your work place. For it is anything but that of it a team player. Oh and as you gain that exp you have so been searching for. You will come to realize that we have some of the best techs from around the world on here. And they have some spare time to post here and there is because of that exp. You'll understand once you reach that summit.
     
    Certifications: Microcomputers and network specialist.
    WIP: Adobe DW, PS
  17. zebulebu

    zebulebu Terabyte Poster

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    Nope - not personally. Just the people who originally gave you what still stands, for the vast majority of people out there. as good, sound advice.
    I think you've missed the point. Nobody on here, to my knowledge, has EVER said that what you've just done CAN'T be done - just that it isn't LIKELY to be done that way, and that it isn't MEANT to be done that way.
    Not true. You don't have any real experience - ergo most of your colleagues (some of whom may well have been eyeing up that 'Senior Network Engineer' role for themselves will not be particularly impressed when they find out you have no real experience. Nor will they look particularly kindly on you when something goes wrong that wasn't covered in books or your labs (incidentally, as I'm sure you'll find out, that covers just about 90% of problems you'll encounter 'on the job'). I'd say that the advice is extremely sage, and that you should heed it.

    What gets most people's goats on here is that what you've done IS possible in this field.

    How would you like to go through a messy divorce, spend weeks searching for a 'Senior Divorce Solicitor' and select one, only to watch your wife's attorney run rings round them in the courtroom, you lose your house, kids, pets and end up living back at your mam's because they'd never actually fought a divorce case in their life, but got the job because they did well on their exams?

    Or how about something going wrong with your brand new Maserati - you shop around and find the name of a 'Senior Maserati Mechanic' from somewhere and take it into him - only to find that your motor knocks like a ****ard when you're 100 yards off the forecourt, the bonnet pops open because the locking mechanism wasn't covered in the manual and the 'Senior' Maserati mechanic had never been exposed to a flaw in the bonnet catch design because they'd never, until YOUR motor, touched one in their life?

    Just because you HAVE done it this way, doesn't mean you SHOULD have!
     
    Certifications: A few
    WIP: None - f*** 'em
  18. dmarsh

    dmarsh Terabyte Poster

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    Thats right folks why don't I buy myself an online degree, a black and decker, practice on a pork chop and a melon and then call myself a brain surgeon ? No need to waste all those years in college and cadavers, real people is where its at !

    http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/life_and_style/health/article3559479.ece

    I mean, how hard can it be right ? I mean its hardly brain surgery...oh wait a minute it is... :twisted:
     
    Certifications: CITP, BSc, HND, SCJP, SCJD, SCWCD, SCBCD, SCEA, N+, Sec+, Proj+, Server+, Linux+, MCTS, MCPD, MCSA, MCITP, CCDH
  19. tripwire45
    Honorary Member

    tripwire45 Zettabyte Poster

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    Fun's fun, troops, but I fail to see the usefulness of continuing this thread. The "He said/she said" pattern is emerging and that kind of "loop" could well continue to the heat death of the universe or the coming of the Messiah (I'm banking on the second option).

    The thread is closed as of now. Nothing more to see here. Move along...move along.
     
    Certifications: A+ and Network+

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