CCNA useless for a Helpdesk Job, right then....

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If you really want to see if you would be hired with the CCNA and CSSP why not as Zeb who has already commented in this thread he is in the position that most of us want to get as a senior system engineer. It would be the likes of him and people of his level that would decide who gets hired as network admins and engineers in his company.

We are not trying to put you off, we are just trtying to steer you in the correct direction.

 

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The bottom rung thing doesn't concern me in the slightest. To be honest it would be a pay rise I would imagine. I just don't want to sit there with a headset on waiting for my next call for 8 hours.

I like to be involved hands on with the equipment.

 

then look for a technicians job. Helpdesk isn't the only starting role in IT.

 

Don't worry - you don't come across as arrogant. For one thing, you can construct a sentence - which instantly elevates you above most of the people who come on here giving it large about walking into a non-first libe job with no experience

What you need to do, IMO, is utterly ignore your first job. See it for what it is - 12-18 months of purgatory whilst you build up the epxerience necessary to get a better job. THAT is when your degree will place you above the majority of other people looking for a second line job. It really will pay off that quickly - when you think about it, a year is about 1/35th of your working life. Do whatever you need to do to get through it - start studying in an area that specifically interests you (security, databases, virtualisation etc), enjoy the money you'll be earning (that will definitely make a change after being a penniless student!) - before you know it, answering phones will be a distant memory

 

Indeed.

So then, I get in as a tea maker in a technician role. How will my qualifications speed up my progression compared to the guy that has been there 12 months and has nothing but experience?

 

depends on how good you are.

see Zebs post above. Makes sense doesn't it?

 

Just because you're taking calls doesn't mean you can't be hands-on with the equipment. Most technical administration can be done via remote support straight from your PC. And that will stay true later in your career as well... there have been many days that I did nothing but administer servers and routers all day long and didn't once get up from my desk.

 

Thanks.

Yes it does make sense. It is a little underwhelming if you like but undoubtedly logical Admiral. I am no genius and I have to work very hard at everything as I started all this a little later than most, so hopefully once I am in and start working as hard at it as I tend to. Then good things will folllow.

 

You're not racing against the one guy who has been at that company for 12 months. You're building up experience so you can qualify for jobs that most of the other 5.5 billion people on the planet won't qualify for.

In truth, most people in IT don't advance within a single organization... they get some experience and they move on to a better position in another company. After all, I'm not gonna wait for Joe Server Admin to get promoted just so I can fill his role! I'm gonna look outside the company!

Your degree and certifications have given you a foundation of theory-based knowledge that you can draw from when needed. So when you finally have a real-world, practical problem in front of you, the education you've had will help you to have an idea of where the problem lies and how it can be fixed. It will help you to do the job quickly and well. But currently, your knowledge doesn't have any real-world "hooks" upon which you can hang that knowledge. By itself, the knowledge doesn't "mean as much". What I mean is this... I can teach you about DNS all day long... but until you start troubleshooting a *real* DNS problem, you can't fully appreciate what you're being taught. You might *know* the theory behind it... but until you start actually working with it in a real-world environment (which aren't perfect lab environments), you'll not get as much out of the knowledge. As you build experience, you can hang your knowledge on those "hooks". Right now, the CCNA terminology and commands don't have any grounding in practical application, no matter how many labs you set up. But once you've started administering networks, the stuff that you learn in the CCNA will make more sense.

Not sure if you understand what I'm trying to say... but eventually, you will. I'm sure of that. You have the drive and determination to succeed, with your only major stumbling block being the whole "I don't wanna deal with idiots" mentality. Dude, IT is first, last, and everything-in-between about support of the user. You'll be supporting "idiot users" as a help desk tech, as a desktop admin, as a server admin, AND as a network admin, so don't think you can escape them by being a network admin. Here's an example: I was setting up Websense to provide Web-based filtering for our 450-user network. But each department had different guidelines as to how they wanted it set up. Some of those guidelines were sensible... some, not so much - but I wouldn't have known that if I had no practical experience. And then there were the users who decided they wanted to surf for pr0n instead of doing their jobs, getting their machines rootkitted... and then there was the user who swore that I had nothing better to do than purposely change her password so she wouldn't be able to log in... all this as a network admin.

I would echo what Zeb said... treat your first IT job as a stepping stone for your next. It's not forever, bro. Just suck it up and drive onward.

 

I was 28 when I got my first "real" IT job, after being the "go-to computer guy" for 6 years and messing with computers for 18 years. So you're not late to the party, I promise you. I'm 40 now, and I've got LOTS of years left!

 

I was 27 (well, 2 months short of it actually) when I started in IT, like Michael I am also 40 and I also have a lot of years left in me (health and heart willing).

 

Lefty,

You are NOT going to get a network administrator role (in the sense you are looking for at least). I don't design the University prospectus so I have no idea why they teach it. Maybe to add value to what is essentially a worthless degree in the real world when it's needed (At the start of the career) and by that, I mean, when was the last time you saw an IT job (not a graduate role) asking for an IT Degree?

Simon is a typical example off the top of my head, he came right out of the army, started at the bottom of IT, he didn't have a degree I don't think, and now is on a pretty damn good deal what I can gather.

I don't have a degree either or a CCNA, I've been in IT only 17 months, and I'm now going on to a Server Engineer role (so no helpdesk chicken).

Not every help-desk is bad, most are not. Too be honest, from the impression I've got from your attitude, you seem like the person who wants to just do, what you want to do, without being realistic and realising you have to do other stuff beforehand. And working with them type of people isn't great from my personal experience. It will work out in the end mate, but you need to start somewhere, in the 2 years you could sit around applying for them jobs and getting rejected, you could of spent actually working in IT, so that 2 years down the line, instead of being sat at home, applying for network admin jobs with no experience, you are sitting there saying "this is what I can do"

Get an entry level job for the time being so you get experience, there is no a rule saying you have to wait XYZ months or years before you can move up, it's all down to what experience you gain. It's not as bad as you think on the front line of IT. Most of us here have done it, and I can say that I enjoyed it, I think a few others will too.

 

Don't panic. I'm not that person, I'm simply just putting it out there to see if it was possible. I sort of found/find it hard to believe that an I.T degree's only use is to stay warm at Reading in August!

Helpdesk is what I am looking to avoid. As you say and I realise what a lovely group of people helpdesk bods may be, one cap does not fit all. So another entry level route seems to be what I am looking for.

I am an I.T sponge at the minute! Let me soak up all your knowledge

 

go for a trainee IT technican role then. You will do a bit of everything and gain that all important network experience or a field service engineer where you are on call and go to various sites in a van to add hardware and solve issues. Helpdesk isn't the only starting point in IT.

 

Let me just give you what i did.

I did my computer network management and design degree, during which we had an industrial placement, where i managed to get a job placed doing desktop support in a 4 person team. This lasted 7 months during which i worked on all aspects of desktop support, with some AD admin and also managing web filter. Then finished uni and got myself a position as IT assistant, doing the same stuff to begin with. As it was just me and my boss i got involved in the server stuff after a few months and i took over the server/network side of things aswell as desktop support. After 18 months in that position i have moved to a large oil and gas company and work in a team of 4 network engineers. I only got my first cert in October last year, and plan on getting my CCNA done sometime this century.

 

Century or decade? One gives you 90 years the other 9.5 years

 

That's because you may think that Unis and colleges teach subjects based on skills that are in demand! Unfortunately they don't! Unis and Colleges are a business and they are in the business of making a profit...sounds naff I know but that is the truth. So they will do and say anything to get those bums on seats as it's all money to them! The fact that they don't seem to mind people getting into debt for their courses says quite a lot!

Don't be to quick to ignore the helpdesk role as many of the best people I have worked with started out in IT on a helpdesk! One important skill that can be learned from a Helpdesk is the ability to work under pressure! Of course the other one is Customer Service.

Good luck anyway!

 

Not ENOUGH time frankly

 

I'll weigh in with a comparison too. why not, its Tuesday!

I dropped out of my (non-IT) degree, and (after months of searching) found a job on the servicedesk. After about 3 months I was promoted to a slightly higher level where I managed to engineer experience in vbscript, and through it secured a secondment into the development team for 6 months. Eventually I left to become a full time developer (after 2 years in the sector). I'm now a Developer making a fairly decent wage (far from the 12k I earned on the servicedesk).

One of they guys in my department studied an IT degree. When he graduated he got a job in woolworths. After several months, he got himself a job in IT (Guess where? Yep thats right - Helpdesk). After about 6 months on Helpdesk, he secured a job as a junior developer in this company and has been working here ever since.

Accounting for the time difference (it took me a few years to decide I wanted to be a developer), and the age difference (I have a few years experience on him), we are in exactly the same position. Despite my not having an degree, we both took the same route into the job we're in at the moment, with approximately the same (adjusted) timescales to do so.