what do you know about UK IT Training centre?

Discussion in 'Training & Development' started by Richdog, Jan 17, 2005.

  1. Clyde

    Clyde Megabyte Poster

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    *lol* sorry mate, but if a glimpse of tit causes you to lose your grasp on reality and spend 6 grand on something you acknowledge you knew nothing about then you deserved what you got!

    edit, and as regards not getting the books up front, thats widespread practice. Not saying its the best way to do things, just saying exect it. That said, ever hear of the internet? could you not have taken some responsibility for your future and done some study before attending the next course? or not as the case may be...

    I have to say I have little sympathy for you after reading this post. You did no prior research, signed up on a whim, and from what I infer, wasted your time between courses.
     
    Certifications: A+, Network+, Security+, MCSA, MCSE
    WIP: MCITP
  2. Arroryn
    Honorary Member

    Arroryn we're all dooooooomed

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    That's the weakest excuse I've heard so far. I'm sorry but...wow. That's bad. I wonder how they try to lure straight women on to your course. Or weren't there any?

    I'm with Clyde on this one. Anyone going for a training provider (that, for whatever reasons, thinks they can't self study) should do their research. If you think you're intelligent enough to keep up with the computing industry and its lovely pace of change, you should have more than enough up top to avoid falling into the traps salespeople set.
     
    Certifications: A+, N+, MCDST, 70-410, 70-411
    WIP: Modern Languages BA
  3. Clyde

    Clyde Megabyte Poster

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    er... if my courses are anything to go by, women, straight or otherwise are in short supply....


    maybe if UK IT or their competitors are reading this they'll compel their male salespeople to wear tight cycling shorts and get buffed up !
     
    Certifications: A+, Network+, Security+, MCSA, MCSE
    WIP: MCITP
  4. Arroryn
    Honorary Member

    Arroryn we're all dooooooomed

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    lol. I wish the salesmen I got visited by had been like that. Wouldn't have changed my judgement, but it would have been nice to look at all the same :)

    If only being in the shallow end of the IT gender pool was a good thing. "You do know this is a technical role, don't you?" was apparently said to a female IT professional writing in Computing Weekly last week.

    Gee. Nice.
     
    Certifications: A+, N+, MCDST, 70-410, 70-411
    WIP: Modern Languages BA
  5. NickyYates

    NickyYates Bit Poster

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    A company named UK IT Training went into solvent members liquidation in April 2004. That's a device used when, for example, a family firm can find no family wishing to carry on the business and wishes to draw a line under their affairs. I find it difficult to understand why they changed the name (to Calt Ltd.) shortly before, and then formed another company with the name UK IT Training Ltd. shortly after.

    Still, not to worry. Since they have been making this offer for around six years (including through the deepest recession this industry has ever experienced) doubtless they will have masses of success stories to show you. Thousands, in fact.

    I suspect that if you ask for some reassurance, they will throw you out on the grounds that you are an ungrateful wretch (see other posts on this forum). The directors have a driving instructor training school where they make the same offer, also a plumbing training school. In fact, it's a myth that we are short of plumbers. If its shortages you're looking for, you need to go to Poland to work (for around £10\day). We have a glut of plumbers due to Polish plumbers coming here.



     
  6. NickyYates

    NickyYates Bit Poster

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    Hi,

    In the previous post, I forgot to add a couple of crucial points. weeks prior to this outfit going into liquidation - their accounts show that they paid a company owned by their MD over £1.5 million! Just to put this into perspective - the year 2003-4 was the worst this industry has ever seen. The Guardian "Money" section had a letter from someone asking for advice - this was about three weeks ago (July 2006). The guy said they promised him a job and qualifications. What he actually got for his £5,800 was five days training and a book!

    The posts on this site explain precisely how this works. If you were ringing a "normal" training provider, you would get a sales pitch. However, when you ring them - the response you get is similar to the one you would receive if you were applying for a charitable place at Eton. It is your job to impress them, not the other way round.

    It is a confidence trick that has been applied to IT training, driving instructor training and plumbing. I believe that they also have a school to train people to implement new laws regarding house sales (your house will have to have a sort of MOT soon).

    There is a general message that I would like to get across to all people training with a company using deceptions to get you to sign up. The fact that you signed a contract is probably irrelevant, unless you had independant legal advice at the time this was entered into. If the context in which you signed this contract was an organised deception masquerading as a job interview, the contract is null and void. Any court in the land would set aside any contract entered into under such circumstances. Some companies say things like "we ask you to go away and consider things for a while before signing up to the course". The reason - they have to do this because of the laws about "cooling off" periods. Just to put this into context, most people financing training do this through the CDL. This is a government scheme that is designed to assist the "financially excluded". The most salient feature of financial exclusion is a lack of financial acumen. To put is in a more understandable way - a lot of people believe that if a company that has unambiguouisly promised you a job reneges on this promise - students imagine that they will refuse to repay the loan. Now... this is a bit silly (the loan is with a bank, not a training provider). However, if you compare this with the situation in the mid 80s where a far more sophisticated group of consumers bought pensions on the basis of a claim that shares can only rise in value and economic booms never end - it isn't THAT stupid. However, don't expect the national emergency that resulted in these people getting their money back. The government couldn't care less. The courts, however, will be on your side.

    UK IT Training have been investigated by the ASA on three occasions. In the course of these, they have NEVER produced a single job they have found, or named a single company in the mysterious "association" of small companies (they say there are 60-100 of these companies. This means that every one of these would be required to take on about 3 network admin staff a year - every year!)

    Interviews, jobs, tests, RUBBISH!! If a training company claims they can teach you to levitate, a contract that shows they have a legal requirement to teach you to levitate (subject to terms and conditions of course) is not "proof". The only thing it proves is that they have to stop you from ever getting to the point where you could invoke this so-called "guarantee". There are some companies training ex-forces people. These guys will get jobs. They are usually technically competent, in the right age group and, above all, they are security cleared. if you're not one of these - just walk away and choose a different training provider.

    Self study is NOT a viable option for most people these days. It runs the serious risk of being yet another of life's unfinished projects. However - do NOT collude in your own deception. You know these outfits are spouting complete rubbish. It's just that you... well... you WANT to believe them. They know this, and they tell you want to hear. Quite often, this will involve saying things like how it's your job to impress us rather than our job to impress you. That's what would happen at a real job interview. Stop punching yourself in the face!!

    Regards

    .................
     
  7. slyuen

    slyuen Byte Poster

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    1. Do a search on this forum for "UK IT".......

    2. Do a Google Search for "UK IT Training Complains"..



    then you'll know what it is. 100% guarantee is B.S.


    whatever you do, do NOT go ahead with this one. Good luck
     
    Certifications: ECDL,A+,Network+,CST,CNST,MCDST,MCSA
    WIP: MCSE, CIW, CCNA, CWNA, Others...
  8. RogueTrooper

    RogueTrooper Bit Poster

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    raggatip, I know how you feel. I was also lured in by that same cleavage, which will haunt me forever, but more so by UKIT's bullshit. I initially had problems getting ID, which I needed to take the ECDL exams. This set me back a while. I then took the CIW course which went well. I pissed the exams. However, after completing the CIW, I found that my next course which I needed to complete within the 12 month period, started 2 days after the 12 month period was up. I asked for an extension on my contract, which they declined to do, restating the contract. They did however, as a gesture of their "goodwill", allow me to do the next course for "free". They have given me no leeway at all. There is no way I'm going to give them any more money, so I've had to give up the course and am looking for another, cheaper way of doing my MCSD. I'm not confident I'll get any of my money back. I would dearly love to stitch them up as much as possible, so please PM me if you have any ideas. Let this be a warning to you all...
     
    Certifications: MCAD CIW Site Designer
    WIP: MCSD
  9. Baldbloke

    Baldbloke Bit Poster

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    Hi

    When I first went into IT, I did a seven week full-time course with a company called Cerco based in Nantwich, Cheshire. At the time, they guaranteed that they would find you a job after successful completion of the course. If they could not find you a post, they would refund you a proportion of the course fee for each month you did not have an IT job, up to 100% of the total cost.

    This did not apply to me as they found me a post immediately after I completed the course, but it may well be worth checking the company out...
     
    Certifications: MCP, A+, Network+, HP APS (Proliant),
    WIP: MCSA/E, Convergence+
  10. Clyde

    Clyde Megabyte Poster

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    AFAIK management restructured the company as relevant tax laws had changed. Nothing sinister as far as I know... Its been business as usual since...

    I expect this is useless misleading advice. I've yet to meet one person who successfully did this...

    First, on what grounds did the ASA investigate them? That may be smoke and mirrors..
    Second, I know for a FACT, they have placed students... not many, in fact very very few, but that's because very very few get to the end of the course in the allotted time.
    Third, as for the associated companies.. I'm dubious...
     
    Certifications: A+, Network+, Security+, MCSA, MCSE
    WIP: MCITP
  11. Clyde

    Clyde Megabyte Poster

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    it may teach you some maturity then...

    UK ITs inductions clearly mention the need for ID and the type of ID that is required. No excuse...

    which means you took 12 months for ECDL and CIW foundations - not good enough.
    When did you sign up, and when did you sit your first ECDL - my guess is you wasted say, 3 - 6 months to this point ?
     
    Certifications: A+, Network+, Security+, MCSA, MCSE
    WIP: MCITP
  12. Clyde

    Clyde Megabyte Poster

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    for what it's worth, based on my own experience, it's hard, but possible to progress through UKITs courses, but I guarantee that 95% of people lack the willpower, determination and sheer hard work ethic to do so.

    I've seen students delay sitting their ECDL for 6 months or so and then complain that they're running out of time! I've seen students waste time between courses and complain that 12 months are not enough.. etc etc..

    Most sign ups fail because they underestimate the requirements. The answer to that is to research before buying.
    A small number, and I have much sympathy for them, are missold a product they have no aptitude for, but what do you expect salespeople to do.. be honest ? fat chance..

    caveat emptor folks.. let the buyer beware...
     
    Certifications: A+, Network+, Security+, MCSA, MCSE
    WIP: MCITP
  13. edenfall

    edenfall New Member

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    Wow where did you get all your information from are you a research student????. The success stories you talk about, I take it your on about the recession that hit us after September 11th of course UK IT training had success stories remember this is a time when loads of people lost their jobs so rather than just sitting around people went out there and got qualifications. Companies stopped paying for training due to the cut backs that were required so people went out and did there own training. Following this, companies gladly recruited people who were already trained.



    The fact that they have other training schools must be an indication that they are successful in training people and guarantying jobs. Shortage of plumbers can’t be myth I recently needed a kitchen tap replaced the earliest I could get someone in was 4 weeks away. These Polish guys no offence but I personally couldn’t trust because I don’t know what the workmanship out there is like.



    I now refer to the 2nd posting that you have made, I’ve looked into this company and found that for £5800 you actually get an MCSA/MCSE along with the ECDL you say you get 5 days training is this a typo did you not mean 50. I am doing this training course with UKIT Training and finding it a really enjoyable experience.



    The way I saw it was that I was being assessed for a guaranteed job in the IT industry once I have qualified. Towards the end of my face to face interview I was told the first half of my training would cost £2550 to become a qualified web designer. I questioned if I could do the whole lot they said it would be £5400 to do the professional courses and the final modules to complete the qualification would be free………………Yes FREE…don’t worry I double checked that one. Oh and then I went to do a test but see I thought that was there to make sure I had the cogs in my head turning, I saw this as a safety measure to see if I had enough about me to do this training. This is the rub, a friend I know failed it so its a genuine test of aptitude. The system clearly works they train people and place them with one of the companies they are associated with, I guess having been around for many years they have a reputation about them that makes companies want to recruit from them. They’ve placed everyone that’s qualified either as a network engineer or web expert. I think this is true as I bumped into a guy in the street who I had met while training who had nearly finished with his mate and both were in great jobs by UK IT training he said. They give you a guarantee of a job in writing or all your money back and they say they have never had to give anyone back there money.



    My general message to any one would be very simple, GO FOR IT!!!!!!!!!!

    :D
     
  14. Clyde

    Clyde Megabyte Poster

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    on the assumption you are replying to my post, I'll answer. No, I'm not a research student. I do have accurate information about the company however.


    huh ? I said that I *KNOW* of people who were placed by UK IT Training. I can name names. I also said that the *VAST* majority who do their courses, don't get to the point where the job guarantee kicks in. I suspect if most did, then the guarantee would prove impossible to honour.


    so long as people see IT as an attractive career choice, they will pay their own way. How different is that from paying for a uni course, or driving lessons or whatever....


    not really, they could be good at *SELLING* - not that I think their trainers are poor, but they are a sales led organisation.

    I don't know what the workmanship of english plumbers is like.. should I refrain from hiring them too ?

    ah, just got this far and realised it's not me you are replying to. Ah well. I've typed all the above so it can stay! Glad you're enjoying the training. My advice is listen to the trainers when they tell you not to slack off. Try and get each cert within 4 - 5 weeks of attending class, and study for the next cert in between sitting the last exam and waiting for the next course. Remember, google is your friend!

    yikes... loads more comments.. anyhow. I'm glad you're enthusiastic. You now need to back that up with HARD WORK. The certs themselves won't get you a job. A good portfolio, knowledge and enthusiasm BACKED UP BY certs, very well may.

    good luck with your studies...
     
    Certifications: A+, Network+, Security+, MCSA, MCSE
    WIP: MCITP
  15. edenfall

    edenfall New Member

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    Sorry about that the response was for NickyYates, but hey thanks for your wise words
     
  16. sandbag

    sandbag New Member

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    This company has such a lot of history that anyone contemplating parting with their money should be very cautious.
    If you are invited to an interview - make sure they sent you the information to read before.
    The "subsidy" you get is just an internal accounting transfer. There is no evidence of employers or the Government giving them subsidies.
    The company has been subject to a judgement by the Office of Fair Trading see
    :www.crw.gov.uk/Undertakings+and+court+action/
    It also appears from previous postings that the company has changed its legal name several times. One of the companies went into liquidaqtion after paying a director a substantial sum.
    The training modules do not run at regular intervals and therefore it will take much longer to gain the qualifications than you might expect. Also the "guarantee" of employment which is pretty worthless anyway doesn't apply until you have paid and taken the second part of the course. THe literature is confusing.
    What puzzles me is that with the level of complaint, how is it that they are still able to provide Microsoft certified training.
    If you have suffered, complain to the Office of Fair Trading
     
  17. Clyde

    Clyde Megabyte Poster

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    Microsoft don't certify their training.
     
    Certifications: A+, Network+, Security+, MCSA, MCSE
    WIP: MCITP
  18. Captain_Fabulous

    Captain_Fabulous New Member

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    I wish I'd found these forums before I signed up to this con.

    I went along to the face to face interview after seeing the advert in the paper and "passing" the telephone interview. I had no experience in IT but was looking for a career change and was prepared to put the effort into re-training. I passed and was invited back the following day to sign the contract and pay for the course. First big mistake. After reading it through I would normally have taken the contract home to read and think about for a few days, but when the salesman said this was not allowed for some reason I signed it there and then. What an idiot. I was interested in doing the course but that alone should've set alarm bells off in my head. The thing that got me hook line and sinker was that the salesman told me that they've never had to return the money to anyone for failing to find a job placement for them. I naively interpereted this to mean that they would find you a job, but in reality it means that there is always some detail in the contract that means they don't have to pay you. I asked the salesman what the success rate was and he simply replied that only about 10% drop out??? Another bloke on the course asked his salesman the same question and he refused to answer. Looking at some of the posts on these forums they rarely place people. I was also told it was possible to get a job placement in 6 months, the other bloke got told 6 weeks???

    I got the ECDL finished within a month and cracked straight on with the CIW course. I managed to do the exams within 4 weeks of completing each 5 day course, however, due to the scheduling of the 3 modules, this took 6 months. I was still well within the time limit to do the professional courses but through no fault of my own it was taking longer than the salesman said it would.

    Next I started the professional courses. These were in no way fully explained to anyone on my course. They consist of 6 modules, each having a 3 to 5 day training period and you get 4 weeks inbetween each to study and pass your exam. So working flat out it'll take at least another 6 months. Everyone on the course was fuming that this hadn't been explained to begin with. Also these are MCAD and MCSD exams, which for me who six months previously had very little IT experience, 4 weeks home study was not enough. Also the book they give you for each module only covers a fraction of the exam, it is up to you to find your own resources. On passing the first exam, I had to wait 12 weeks to get scheduled on the next course. When I finally got on the course the people in reception told me that there had been another course inbetween but had failed to tell me despite the fact that I had been ringing them regularly to make sure they didn't forget me. I didn't waste my time asking for an apology, and as stated in another post the people on reception are rude, ignorant monkeys. After passing the next exam I had to wait a further 9 weeks to get on the next course. 11 months after starting the professional courses I am still none the wiser about those subjects even though I have managed to pass a couple of exams. I feel I was completely mis-sold the course, which I initially thought was an opportunity to learn a new skill and start a career in an industry with a future, but in actuall fact it has turned out to be a very expensive and time consuming lesson.

    Anyone who is thinking of doing this training, DON'T! A better bet would be to order a home study course. There are plenty about for a fraction of the cost. Even at UKIT the studying is home based using resources you find for yourself. The training they give you at Tolworth and the books they give you are virtually worthless because it's only a very very small part of the actual work you do. Even the scheduling is down to you and they don't deliver on that. Everything is down to you anyway once you've paid and you could easily never even hear from them again, so save your money and spend it on some decent software to build up a web portfolio to show any prospective employer, rather than go near these bums-on-seats cowboys.

    I was lured by the "no experience necessary" rubbish, but now I am aware that potential application/solution developers should have 2 to 5 years of experience before they start the training. £5600 course fee, 17months, £560 exam fees, and hundreds of pounds more on software/hardware/books later, I am no closer to getting a job in the IT industry. What a waste of money. They saw me coming a mile off.
     
  19. zebbrox

    zebbrox New Member

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    I am currently doing my MCSA/MCSE at UKIT. I had a problem at the beginning trying to get on the first module but I have to say it hasn’t been too bad so far.
    The trainers I’ve had also have been pretty good and one in particular has gone out of his way to help me when I was stuck.

    Before I signed up I must admit I was a bit sceptical about the job guarantee but I was torn about whether to get into debt and go to uni and then struggle to get a job because I had no experience or to do this, which at least had a promise of getting something at the end of it. I must admit I’m kind of glad I chose this route. I’ve checked out the contract they gave me about the job guarantee and it seems pretty sound. I know the job won’t be at a high level to start with but that’s OK. Also met a student who had finished her training and was having their pre-interview or something when I was in the waiting room – and that gave me a bit of a boost! I know I’ve got to do this within the set time but I don’t see that as a problem – even so I’m going to make sure I do it not matter what! It’s worth a shot I reckon!
     
  20. hyperscooter

    hyperscooter New Member

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    I got friends who went to uni to do an IT degree and some of them also dropped out, now stuck with student debt so I guess it’s almost the same sort of thing.

    It’s a tough call. Nowadays you can’t get job without qualifications and or experience especially in IT. Catch 22 really!

    If it’s the sort of job that you want to do then I would advise you to keep at it mate. Get on as many courses as you can – sod the costs! Nothing in life comes without hard work and determination – sorry to sound preachy!
     

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