Want to start CCNA course and know about commsupport.co.uk

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If you can pass the A+ with little-to-no studying, then do it. Certification isn't primarily to teach you new stuff... it's to show employers that you have knowledge regarding a technology.

To study for the Network+, you need to study Network+ materials, not CCNA materials. There's a LOT on Network+ that isn't on the CCNA. The CCNA deals with Cisco gear and how to configure it... the Network+ is vendor-neutral, and much more generic. And... the Network+ is geared to people at the beginning of their IT careers. The CCNA is geared towards people who are already in a networking job in IT (which you DON'T typically start out doing).

If you came to me with a CCNA without experience, and someone else came in with a Network+ cert without experience, I'd likely give it to the Network+ person. First, I'm not going to hire someone without experience to work with Cisco gear, so your certification would not be as relevant to the job as the person with the A+ or Network+. Second, you'd be too big of a risk to hire for three reasons, one of which Sparky has already brought up:

1) You're a flight risk... as Sparky stated, with the CCNA, you'll likely leave when something better comes along... and then I'll have to do the employee search again, find the right person, hire them, and train them from scratch all over again.
2) With the CCNA, you'll likely demand more money than the Network+ person. That may not be true - you may be willing to take as little as the Network+ person. But with only your CV to go by, I'll not likely go through the hassle of calling you up and interviewing you just to find out that your salary requirements are far out of line with what I want to pay for an entry-level tech.
3) I'd likely tag you as a "paper cert" and, to be honest, a potential braindumper (someone who gets their certifications using "cheat sheets"), considering your lack of real-world experience. The overwhelming majority of people who get their CCNA certifications without experience resort to cheating to get them through. Some people use braindumps without realizing they're doing it... even some trainers get their students to use them just so they'll pass the exam. In any case... you may or may not even consider doing something like that... but as an employer who doesn't KNOW you, I don't know that. The chance is too great for me to take the risk of hiring you.

Yes, but those aren't typically entry-level jobs. You'll be competing for those jobs against people who have experience... and the experienced tech will get the job every time.

All it takes is ONE experienced guy with ANY experience under his belt and willing to work to compete against you for the same job... and then you'd become the second most attractive applicant... and unemployed. Gotta look at this through the eyes of an employer.

The A+ and N+ are good choices... but like the CCNA, you should hold off on the MCSE until you have experience. Microsoft recommends a year of experience administering a 250+ user, multi-site, multi-server environment before attempting the MCSE... not a year in IT, but a year doing THAT job.

Passion and enthusiasm do not enable you to administer a network; experience does. And there are *plenty* of willing, hard-working, experienced IT professionals out there who will do those jobs. We're not all the stereotypical "Nick Burns" techs... in fact, most are not. Most are guys who started out just like you... and they stayed passionate throughout their careers.

It's great that you have that passion and enthusiasm. But if I'm hiring someone to administer my network, I wan't someone who has done it before... not someone who can learn it. The stability of the network is far too important to entrust to someone who "wants to learn it" and hasn't done it before.

Don't take this the wrong way... you can eventually reach that point. But you have to be patient and take things one step at a time... get your entry-level certifications (A+, Network+) and an entry-level IT job... then start building experience so you can take the next step and the next step and the next step.

If you don't take things one step at a time, you'll likely end up like other impatient techs I've seen who have gone down the overcertification road... they try to get jobs they're unqualified for, continue to get denied, and eventually give up, frustrated and hopeless. I don't want that to be you. Do things the right way... one step at a time. If you have the knowledge and the desire, you'll likely advance up the IT career ladder fairly quickly.

 

Hi Bosonmichael,

I'd like to reply to a few of the points you have raised. Firstly i have noticed your from the USA where employment differs alot from the UK, not just the laws but the whole working ethic is totally different there. iIm not saying one is better than the other just different.

In the UK a CCNA is regarded higher than a N+ and really an A+ is for desktop support, Every networking job and junior networking job i have seen all would all prefere the candidates have a CCNA, not one says must have N+.

Your point about me being a flight risk is BS, say i come to you with N+ and during the year pass a CCNA, whats the difference to me comming with a CCNA in the first place..... Also i would work for an employer that hadn't set out a progression path for me anyway. I don't expect to start at the top but i do expect to be rewarded for hard work and learning.

I like the way you think anybody who can pass a ccna with out experience must be cheating...... no some people just have the ability to learn. Cisco state that no experience is needed for this exam.

You said you wouldn't let anybody configure your cisco kit without experience, so how do they get it in the first place??

It appears to me that people on this board hate people getting a CCNA and getting a job.....i'm still going to take the advice of my friend who is CCIE, works for Cisco he got his CCNP , CCVP, CCDP, and CCIE within 5 years, now i suppose he must have cheated and couldn't possibly do that in that time......i think people here are jealous of people getting a head start just because they didn't.


I quite liked this board till i started reading all the doom bringers.......well if we all take the exam and don't get a job then you can say i told you so........ But i can't wait to post on here.....when i pass my CCNA and land a job and i'll rub your noses in it. I think it about time you moved with the times. CCNA is the minimum needed these days.


Christ69

 

Unfortunatley Chris if someone get the CCNA or MCSE it is regarded as a paper MCSE or CCNA which means employers will look at your cv then most likley bin it when they see the no experience part, as I have said earlier we have people who join CF all the time who say I have my CCNA or MCSE and no experience but cant get a job. This is because they have no experience. and are over certified for their experience.

Most people can get a qualification with time and study but not everyone can apply what they have studied in the real world, thats why MCSE and CCNA candidates should have the experience.

Its not being a doom birnger its telling the truth.

 

Hi while you made some valid points I'm afraid the "mob" on this forum disagree with you and what they says goes they are not to keen on people disagreeing with them so I would cut your loses on this thread, or they will just keeping posting telling you why you are wrong, anyway welcome to the forum!

 

hey Rob its not that anyone is being antogonistic its the truth, yes some people may get lucky and get a job but it'll be very unlikely with cisco gear but the majority of people with getting the CCNA and experience wont get anywhere with it.

 

Hi Guy's,

What i find hard to beleive is a CCNA won't get me a job at the bottom of the pile to get the experience.
How the hell do you get experience with out being given the chance. I fully expect not to be let loose on kit for quite a while till i've proved myself and i don't expect the CCNA wages but it must prove that i have the apptitude for networking. Plus i'm also looking at the telecoms industry where i have a few friends, things like pre-sales and post sales. And even in sales a CCNA would do any harm there. Also a company would be expecting to train you on all the kit they sell, so the ccna just says "I have a good base to start from".

I soppose i should put this thread to bed now...and anyway the reason for replying in this was to say im going on the Commsupport course and will let everyone know what its like after i complete the course.
So far the communication from Joe there as been great and the free day was a great way to see how they work.... I do appreciate everyones opinion here but just don't tar everyone with the same brush...

Thanks everyone!!


Christ69

 

Just as a quick comment on this discussion. I work for a well-known ISP, and we have quite a few in the networking team who *don't* have CCNA. They got there by having experience.

Harry.

 

If you actually learn the material and understand what you're doing with Cisco kit then you've got more chance of getting the job with the CCNA than without. Sadly not everyone with the CCNA credential understands how to use or config a router and that's what annoys people in the industry.

I actually worked with a CCNP who didn't know what a console cable was. It shows the state of affairs when a person like myself who has never touched a router can identify a console cable and a CCNP can't.

Like I've said study hard and really learn your stuff, and get plenty of hands on experience. Do this and I'm sure the CCNA will benefit your career.

Rob I don't think the problem is the "mob". It's the people who don't like to hear how hard their study is going to be. The people who have decided they'll take a week long course and start earning more than most seasoned IT professionals.

I think you'll find the message has always been the same:

• Don't expect a piece of paper to get you the job
• Don't expect a piece of paper to get you a starting salary of £27,000
• Don't think a few days on a course is enough to pass
• Expect to work hard
• Get plenty of hands on experience

In short be realistic about what you can achieve in a given time frame and what that will equate to in the real world of IT.

 

Yes, but most everyone on this forum is from the UK... and most of them will say the same thing I said, above.

Think about this logically, mate: Why would a CCNA be required for desktop support?

Desktop support isn't a "networking job" or a "junior networking job"... it's desktop support. I think you've got the two confused.

You can think it's BS... but that's exactly what employers will think. Mate, I've been in the industry for 10 years, and I've seen it all before. The employer's perception is what gets you the job... not yours.

I never said that. I said that many employers will believe that the chances of someone without experience cheating on the CCNA is much greater. And it is.

Cisco does NOT state that no experience is needed for that exam. Cisco doesn't mention it at all.

The same way I got it - after I was hired, helping a network admin out with configs.

No, I don't hate them at all. I'm simply giving you advice because I don't want to see you have a difficult time. I'm posting for YOUR benefit, mate... not mine.

I had plenty of a head start. I had 18 years of messing around with computers before I got my first real IT job. And my career took off quite nicely. 10 years later, my career is set; I'm doing quite well. And I want others to succeed similarly.

Please do. Your testimony will be valuable.

You can get a job with the CCNA... I'm simply trying to point out why, in some cases, a CCNA without experience can make it harder for you. I never said it was impossible.

I wish you the best of luck.

 

All,

Just thought Id add my 2 penny's worth in! I attend the December weekend course at commsupport and was very pleased with everything on the course. Joe is a nice guy and very down to earth also a good teacher.

Id recommend commsupport to anyone but would advise them that they are long days and you do have to work on reading and practicing the commands outside of class but as many of you have said you cant complete a CCNA in 5 or 6 days.

Keep it going Joe doing a great job.

Kev

 

Ah, yet another first-time poster praising a training company...

...they'll never learn, will they?

 

Where are these posts. People coming here all the time saying they have ccna or mcse and no job. Can you provide some links i have done searches but have not found any.

 

Keep looking, you'll find them!

 

have a look in new members forums because half of them are people who just joined to say that they are certified but unemployable, we tell tell them why and they nevr come back.

There are a few in the Microsoft forum use the advanced search so you can use keywords.

 

I'm sorry but I can't find any. You stated that people come to this site ALL THE TIME with a CCNA and none of them can get a job. If this is happening all the time on this forum surely I would of pulled out quite a few. Maybe it's my lack of experience in the real world, so could you point me in the direction of lets say 4 or 5 examples of these posts.

Thanks in advance.

 

Personally, no - I prefer to spend my spare time replying to people genuinely seeking advice, not rejecting those who provide them with reality checks.

 

There's one which took me all of ten seconds to find using the search tool http://www.certforums.co.uk/forums/thread21411.html

 

I was concentrating on the ccna of which i did eventually find one. Thanks for your time.

 

Get some networking experience by working your way there from a support role get the N+. Eventually after enough networking experience you will be introduced to CISCO and be ready to study for the CCNA.