Learn English or go to jail

Discussion in 'The Lounge - Off Topic' started by tripwire45, Mar 29, 2008.

  1. neilmowforth

    neilmowforth Bit Poster

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    Ok, I disagree though. I worked in holiday resorts in France and Switzerland for 2 years. In this time I got to know a lot of the locals and I know they would be a lot worse off with out the money which we bring.

    Have you ever visited a country where you (or any member of your group) couldn't speak the language? You must be very lucky if this is true.
     
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  2. Fergal1982

    Fergal1982 Petabyte Poster

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    no, I havent. In each of the (admittedly few) cases where I holidayed in a foreign country, a member of my party spoke the language (luckily, they spoke it fluently). There are some cases where its unavoidable to enter a country without being able to speak the language - such as being sent off for business.

    Not to be rude, but I dont give a damn about the tourism board, or the income it generates. I'll say this again: its incredibly rude and arrogant to go to a country, either to live, or holiday, and not be able to speak the language at least enough to get by (exceptions as stated previously).

    Edit: I mean, seriously, how difficult is it to go on a short course, or pick up a beginners book, and at least attempt to learn enough to get by before you go? Why is it acceptable to go somewhere and speak loudly until you are understood? Answer: its not!
     
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  3. neilmowforth

    neilmowforth Bit Poster

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    Well that's your opinion. I think we should agree to disagree though.
     
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  4. Phoenix
    Honorary Member

    Phoenix 53656e696f7220 4d6f64

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    Fergal
    your right, it is
    but how much do you consider 'enough to get by' for a vacation thats very bloody little depending where you go
    a lot of tourist hot spots are bi lingual for a REASON, so that the language boundry is not so high as to scare off potential tourists

    that said, I knew very little german when I went on my photography workshop last year, but I learnt enough pretty quickly to survive alone, whilst trying to be polite

    When I was a kid, I was in france, and a shop owner would not serve me until I asked for it in (albiet very poor) french
    the fact it was crap french he didnt mind, he could speak fluent english, he wanted me to make the effort, and those that do are never looked upon as rude or arrogant
    to TRY when on vacation is all that can be asked of a respectful tourist, its the effort that signifies the respect, most will happily assist in your native tongue ones you have provided some level of effort

    Similar can be said for tourists here, do you ignore a struggling tourist because there English skills are poor? hell no you go out of our way to assist as best you can, if i can even remotely grasp, or say something back in there own language I WILL DO as again its a sign of respect for each other, your trying to resolve a need doing as best you both can
     
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  5. Fergal1982

    Fergal1982 Petabyte Poster

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    Dont disagree with you there at all Phoenix. I would say, for a holiday, enough to get by is enough to perform the basic common activities - book into a hotel, order food, ask for the bill. That kind of things. Doesnt have to be perfect, even crude but understandable is enough.

    Most tourist areas do speak english. And most will happily speak english, when you make the effort. Quite often they will drop into english when you are struggling to ask for what you want, help you figure out what to say, then let you say it. Thats great. That french shopkeeper of yours had it spot on.

    I'm in no way asking for holidaymakers to be fluent in the language, or even be good enough to get by easily without a phrasebook, its the effort thats significant. Living in a country is an altogether different matter - whilst leeway is (and should be) given at the start of their life in the country, I would expect them to be capable enough to get by day to day without real difficulty within say.. 6 months? proper fluency can take years for some people.
     
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  6. Phoenix
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    Phoenix 53656e696f7220 4d6f64

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    Spot on mate, agree totally
     
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  7. tripwire45
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    tripwire45 Zettabyte Poster

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    My wife and I went with a tour group to Germany, Switzerland, Italy, and Austria. Our tour guide spoke several languages, but the bus driver only German. We all learned enough to "get by" ("Where is the restroom" was at the top of *my* list) but there were interesting results.

    My wife spoke (Brazilian) Portugese and tried it out on an Italian Catholic priest. Didn't work out, so well. We had one fellow who tried to order a pepperoni pizza only to get a pizza with red and green bell peppers on it. I remember trying to fake a restaurant order in Rome and getting some "interesting" food served up, but it was all an adventure. No one seemed to take offense and we got to see and do all sorts of interesting things.

    There were a few in our party (remember, these are Americans), that would get upset if a restaurant didn't sell hamburgers or some sort of food they were familiar with, but that was there problem. The reason to visit places that are different is *because* they're different.

    My daughter spent 11 months in Japan as a high school exchange student. She knew virtually no Japanese when she went over but living with a Japanese family, she learned quickly. She says that fluency would take years but she has enough to hold a fairly good conversation. She does admit that it's exhausting, though...you constantly have to be listening and focusing on what people are saying in order to understand, and then crafting proper responses in a "second" language is just as tiring.

    She *can* watch Japanese movies without subtitles and have phone conversations with her Japanese host family (who don't speak English) completely in Japanese.
     
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  8. dales

    dales Terabyte Poster

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    Hmm this one could get heated, but i suppose it depends a bit on where your going, if your going to costa-del-uk or a specific resort (ski/leisure resort) then maybe learning the lingo isnt required (or at least minimal amounts of the language skills). But then it would be required when mixing with the locals!

    Suppose I cant really comment as I've only been to paris once for a weekend and used some of the language i aquired at school, but I've no intention to travel anywhere foreign (dont do boats or planes you see).
     
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