£3225 for course. Urgent Help needed!

Discussion in 'Training & Development' started by mickaveli2001, Sep 24, 2008.

  1. mickaveli2001

    mickaveli2001 Byte Poster

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    I phoned the bank, and they said they couldn't block it. It came off on Thursday, and unfortunatly I never seen my bank statement online until the Saturday morning.

    I have been back on the phone to the Training Provider, and they say that because I have sent a recorded delivery letter to Barclays Finance (but haven't with them), that I am still secure enough, because when Barclays finance get a letter of cancellation to them, they e-mail the training provider with the details of the cancellation, so that they can then make the amendments on their system...

    I have to get added onto the training providers system before they can remove me from it :blink makes no sense to me, but that's the way they do it. They also said that if I send in the materials, they provide a freepost address, because I told them in no way that I was paying to deliver the materials back to them after all this. Only once they have the materials (crappy introductary leaflets, cd-rom, and half an A+ homemade guide) to them, I will get a refund. 3-4 weeks is a long time, and this experience has put me right off ANY training provider now, I know the site staff say that bad mouthing training providers shouldn't be done, but this is soley the view of one individual from one persons experience, and I think there should be a named/shamed, pro/con evaluation on these training providers, because al ot of people may be drawn into it, and being a website that's helpful would warrant such an evaluation from some of its members I think
     
    Certifications: NC Communication/Computing
    WIP: A+
  2. UCHEEKYMONKEY
    Honorary Member

    UCHEEKYMONKEY R.I.P - gone but never forgotten. Gold Member

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    Funny I was thinking the same thing.. Why oh Why did you apply for it!

    There's so many horror stories about TP's most of them are on CF!8)
     
    Certifications: Comptia A+
    WIP: Comptia N+
  3. simongrahamuk
    Honorary Member

    simongrahamuk Hmmmmmmm?

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    Lets not forget though that CF isn't just about self studying. It's about helping members to achieve their goals, be that with or without the use of a Training Provider CF is here to help. 8)
     
  4. dmarsh

    dmarsh Petabyte Poster

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    You went into it with your eyes open and signed over £3500, think yourself lucky you got out of it at all. Thats the real world of business, never sign anything unless you are sure what you are getting into. Never arrange for a salesperson to visit you when you are ill.

    You can't really bad mouth them because they haven't even been given a chance to deliver a service yet, you entered into an agreement that you then decided you could not afford.

    Learn the lesson and chalk this one up to experience, £75 is a cheap way to learn such a lesson. :D
     
  5. mickaveli2001

    mickaveli2001 Byte Poster

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    I really thought that by signing it, it could be easily cancelled with no problem, just like AXA Insurance. I signed up for this, and cancelled within a week, and that was the end of AXA with no problems, simple!!! I thought there was some 5-7 days before they could take money out, and I think I was misled, and misold on a lot of it

    Not this though. People, or any company (IE: Skillstrain) who is quick to take money out of an account, but very slow to put it back in can't be trusted IMO Only my views do not reflect that of the site or its staff and are the views of me only
     
    Certifications: NC Communication/Computing
    WIP: A+
  6. Arroryn
    Honorary Member

    Arroryn we're all dooooooomed

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    I wholly agree with this.

    From what I can remember, Skillstrain do their accounts processing/payments processing on a specific date each month, which is why you possibly have to wait so long for a refund - I had to wait a few weeks for my exam refunds, because of the time of the month I sat them.

    TBH, it sounds like a classic case of someone signing up to something before ever truly thinking it through. Yeah, TPs sure as hell are expensive, but I haven't received bad service from Skillstrain at all. I don't advocate the shady sales tactics that are sometimes used but hey, most sales people are shady. In hindsight, I would have been better off self studying A+ and N+, but at the time I didn't have the confidence. Skillstrain have delivered to the letter what they said they would. If I'm the one that's paying that little bit extra for it, then it was my adult decision to make.

    As DMarsh has already said - consider £75 a cheap lesson learned. Never sign on to anything from salesmen on your doorstep. Especially when they say the offer is "one day only".
     
    Certifications: A+, N+, MCDST, 70-410, 70-411
    WIP: Modern Languages BA
  7. dmarsh

    dmarsh Petabyte Poster

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    This is common practice, I've had to wait 4 months to get a payment from a recent client. People often overpay on utilities or tax and have to wait months or years also. Some people never get their money back.

    Why enter into an agreement if you know you are going to cancel ? You opened the door to allow the company to screw you around, every agreement you have is more paperwork and hassle, if they are reliable you are lucky.

    I learned this lesson when I was young the hard way when I took a garage car loan without checking the rate, it was 22%, by the time I found out I had no chance to cancel and just had to make the payments.
     
  8. UCHEEKYMONKEY
    Honorary Member

    UCHEEKYMONKEY R.I.P - gone but never forgotten. Gold Member

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    True, and as I stated in this thread here:- Advent Training

    I'm just suprised at mickaveli not doing his research, I know we all get taken in from PR stunts and TV adverts. But I would of thought he would have alarm bells ringing in his head when the sales man told him how much the course was!

    Like I said "I had a similiar experience with Computeach and ended up spilling tea all over the carpet when he told me how much it was ! £5k to do a MCSE! Although he made it sound like an Hollywood film like hackers or sneakers -saying I could use the MCSE to work for banks trying to hack thier defences!

    Yeah right! Do people actually believe those stories???

    The bigger laugh was yet to come when a rep from NITLC came round saying he was in the army before joining NITLC and anyone in the army is taught not to lie? WTF!

    He then went on to say they only accept the cream of the cream at NITLC and I must do a test, this plus my file goes before a panel of 5 people who will decide if they can offer a place on the course! it's to filter out those who are not academically minded

    If that wasn't enough he try to sell me some red wine he got from France which was in the boot of the car?

    Luckly I google the Tp's and found feedback here on CF"

    Just look at the mess it get's you into when you try and pull out of a signed deal with a TP8)
     
    Certifications: Comptia A+
    WIP: Comptia N+
  9. Arroryn
    Honorary Member

    Arroryn we're all dooooooomed

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    Studying with Training Providers

    A shameless plug for an article I've written, but it includes dealing with sales people, as well as my experience with the TP in mention in this thread.
     
    Certifications: A+, N+, MCDST, 70-410, 70-411
    WIP: Modern Languages BA
  10. kevicho

    kevicho Gigabyte Poster

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    From my reading of the thread hes signed up for something he cant afford, and all companies take ages to do refunds, so other than my usual opinion of self study is better and cheaper for the majority, I think this is more make sure you research all you options before making even the phone call
     
    Certifications: A+, Net+, MCSA Server 2003, 2008, Windows XP & 7 , ITIL V3 Foundation
    WIP: CCNA Renewal
  11. westernkings

    westernkings Gigabyte Poster

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    I can't stand salesman, if i want something, I will buy something. No I don't want a free PS3, nor do I carea bout 25% off, I am not that cheap. Sadly I am also easily pressured.

    Somepeople handle pressure better than others, saying no is a pretty hard thing to do as i'm sure we can all agree, when a guy is making you feel like your a bad person but "leading the salesman on", you just end up feeling uncomfortable and go "ok"
     
    Certifications: MCITP:VA, MCITP:EA, MCDST, MCTS, MCITP:EST7, MCITP:SA, PRINCE2, ITILv3
  12. BosonMichael
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    BosonMichael Yottabyte Poster

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    I agree completely. Dude, you can complain about their refund practices all you want, but the bottom line is this: it was your fault for signing on the dotted line. Not trying to kick you while you're down... but you're unjustifiably taking your frustrations out on the training provider. No, I'm not saying that I agree with their hard-sell practices... but their refund and cancellation procedures seem pretty reasonable. MOST companies are quick to debit (because they're about to provide a service or good) and slow to refund (particularly when you're not even in their system yet).

    You should be thankful that they're taking the time to wait on your information to be entered before removing you. Consider the alternative: if they were to try to remove you now, saw that you weren't there, and simply said you're not in the system, then several days later after your paperwork clears, you WOULD appear in their system, and you WOULDN'T have been removed. And by that point, it may be too late for them to "officially" remove you.

    Sounds like you've got a track record of agreeing to things and then cancelling them. You don't HAVE to be a victim, just chalking it up to being "easily pressured"... YOU make the decisions for YOUR best interests - nobody else is going to (nor should they be required to). So next time, just say "No" or "I have to do my research first." If not, then next time, you may not be so lucky. You seriously got off light this time. I made a mistake that had extra zeroes on the end of it... but I learned from it - I didn't make that mistake again. I hope you don't have to learn the hard way. It's not fun. Congrats for getting out of it.
     
    Certifications: CISSP, MCSE+I, MCSE: Security, MCSE: Messaging, MCDST, MCDBA, MCTS, OCP, CCNP, CCDP, CCNA Security, CCNA Voice, CNE, SCSA, Security+, Linux+, Server+, Network+, A+
    WIP: Just about everything!
  13. wizard

    wizard Petabyte Poster

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    Did any of you watch the classic "One Foot in The Grave Episode" when Victor invited a salesman round that had shouted at him in a road rage incident :D
     
    Certifications: SIA DS Licence
    WIP: A+ 2009
  14. Gary B

    Gary B Nibble Poster

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    I can't believe the attitudes of some of you saying serves you right and £75 is a cheap lesson learned etc etc.

    Without knowing the person in question or the pressure applied and 'sales techniques' used I don't see how you can make such a judgement.

    There are very strict laws in the UK about doorstep selling as there are ruthless organisations who take advantage of people, and by that you don't have to be a little old lady, their sales pitches have evolved in to a fine art.

    So much so that the 7 day cooling off period for cold calling sales from as little as £35 is being extended from the home to the workplace also

    Whilst I haven't fallen foul of them so far I do have sympathy for those that have. You need to get the £75 back also maybe a phone call to them and then talk of going to your local paper to warn other people against using them - that's worked for me before during a complaint or have a word with the CAB for free legal advice.

    You should not be a penny worse off at the end of this and hopefully a little wiser too - good luck
     
    Certifications: MCSA 2003
    WIP: You tell me
  15. dmarsh

    dmarsh Petabyte Poster

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    He will get a full refund if he follows the process and returns the materials.

    Learning to say no to pushy salespeople is a valuable life skill, it must be learned.

    I've been caught myself many times, the point is to learn not to get caught, a £3225 lesson would have been far worse no ?

    What if it was a con man ? What if it wasn't a doorstep salesman ? He would have quite possibly lost the full amount, thats why he needs to learn to say NO ! Relying on refund schemes is not the answer...

    If you must pay for a Training Provider, whats wrong with paying in installments without any credit and without a contract ? If the provider doesn't offer this maybe you should look elsewhere ? Many colleges are quite happy to work on this basis...

    This casual attitude to credit agreements is one reason why the whole worlds currently going to S%!T!
     
  16. mickaveli2001

    mickaveli2001 Byte Poster

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    I understand that it is my fault at the end of the day, and that it's my responsibility due to signing the agreement.

    The only thing that annoys me is the hassle and deviousness of the sales, and how £75 comes off straight away, and they didn't even ask if I was financially able to have £75 come off within 2 DAYS. I understood I was entering a 'credit agreement', which was the only thing explained to me. They may have given me the paper for the enrolment fee, but they just whisked that one along under the credit agreement form, and basically said, that I had to sign the enrolment form as agreeing to enrol. Nothing esle got explained about any immediate payment. My fault I know, but they should have made me aware.

    For people who want to put their futures and ambitions in the hands of educators or training providers, they have to realise that they should present themselves "honestly" and fully from the get go. I would never ever put my educational aspirations or dreams in the hands of people who have sneaky menthods, and perform their sales 'tactics' when it's to do with the quality of my life
     
    Certifications: NC Communication/Computing
    WIP: A+
  17. dmarsh

    dmarsh Petabyte Poster

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    I agree, one problem seems to be that your average 16-18 year old school leaver, without that much life experience and a passion for IT could get badly burnt by a TP, if they don't do their own independant research. Universities and Colleges at least have some regulation and standards.
     
  18. UCHEEKYMONKEY
    Honorary Member

    UCHEEKYMONKEY R.I.P - gone but never forgotten. Gold Member

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    Actually mate, thinking back to when I got visited by these salesmen, I would probably done the same thing!
    Signed up for a course, these people are not human, they don't even work in IT, they are just salesmen and will do or say anything to sell their product and get your money. Even it's not true, they would sell their own family just to get your money.

    There was a BBC documentary about Training providers here's the thread:-

    Inside Out - IT Training companies post No.11 gives a link (provided by Sparky) to download TV documentary about IT training providers. It's amazing one company uses a actor to sell their IT training course. It's worth a look mate:thumbleft:biggrin8)
     
    Certifications: Comptia A+
    WIP: Comptia N+
  19. Markyboyt

    Markyboyt Kilobyte Poster

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    I think people have already covered the main points, but ill just add my 10p

    First things first, anything like the letters you sent that HAVE to arrive on time and with proof must be sent Special delivery, recorded only proves that it arrives, if it arrives at all, I have had recorded delivery mail lost in the past. I do think it maybe would have been worth putting the letter to the TP recorded instead of standard as its only an extra 90p or something.

    I was starting to get down about work and knew I wanted a change into IT, thats when these adverts on the telly and stuff really wear you down, plus a guy who used to live next door left the army and di a computeach course and he now does very well for himself although he has moved away so im not sure what he does exactly, but with all that I decided to look into training providers and what they cost and was amazed to find how much they were but was still weighing them up, was also down for a call from computeach, looked at open uni etc, then while searching in a search engine this site came up and it was a very useful thread about self study by (I cant remember his name, begins with a Z, hes staff and has a penguin avatar :lol:) but that was the end of the TP for now at least and the books got ordered.

    Have to say though that when computeach called a few days later I told the lady that I had decided against using them and she just said 'ok, ill remove you from our records then'

    EDIT: Also forgot to add that as crap as it is, I'd be accepting that they were taking the £45 admin fees and count my lucky stars I didnt have to pay £3225 for something I didnt want. The lesser of 2 evils so to speak. I would continue as you are regarding the £75 though for definite
     
    WIP: A+
  20. greenbrucelee
    Highly Decorated Member Award

    greenbrucelee Zettabyte Poster

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    I agree. We had a bit of a debate a while ago where I got shouted at a bit because, I said doing research was easy and you could find out what certifications etc you could do for your experience level.

    When I was 16 and went to college to do my GNVQ in IT I found out very quickly by reading notice boards and information web sites that there was a cert called the MCSE and it was for people who already worked in the industry and knew what they were doing. At the time I think the MCSE was based on NT 3.51 (can't remember exactly). So I knew that this was out of league, it's weird how some people do it and don't realise what they are getting into and how it can hurt their careers if they have no experience.

    What I didn't know was that you could study on your own and take the exams when you wanted at a test centre. Thats when I found this place and was informed of this option.

    There needs to be tighter regulations on TPs and people need to pass on the info that self study is an option.
     
    Certifications: A+, N+, MCDST, Security+, 70-270
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