This sucks...

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This is linked to other posts made about a similar topic. I'll set the scene.

I've been doing an MCP course for a few months now, and started applying for jobs. Nothing unusual in that, however, I'm 29 now, and have done maybe 5 or 6 jobs since the age of 20, and have been told by several of the companies I've applied for that even though I've an HND in IT, even though I'm doing current training by way of an MCP, and ec Royal Navy for over 4 years, that "you've had too many jobs". What am I meant to do? Change my CV?

Through my 20's, I travelled shed loads, to fund it I did customer service jobs for 6 to 9 months here and there, picked up a little experience as I went along. I wouldn't have changed that for anything, and I did serve for almost half a decade in the RN. Being selective is one thing, however, for an industry that is supposedly short of people to the tune of 200,000+ people per year (figures quoted in Computer Weekly around 3 months ago), this seems ludicrous to me. Sorry for ranting guys, but I'm starting to think that unless you as an individual went straight into IT after uni/school, or had the same job for many years, and then transferred you can forget it. *Sighs*.....

Like I said, don't mean to rant, just starting to think that this whole "getting into IT" thing is a waste of time.

 

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i think it just takes perseverance, sooner or later you will break in if you don't give up.
btw what certs or mcp thingies do you have?

 

I'm doing XP professional, Windows 2003 Server, I've done the basics like A+ which came with the course too, and I've an HND in IT.

I'm not looking for mega-bucks, I realise I can't (for now) command big bucks, I'm hoping for an entry level job where you don't have to be a graduate.

Thanks for the words mate, just feel really arse at the minute. I've only been looking for 6 weeks or so... *Must learn patience - must learn patience - must learn patience - must learn patience*... That will be my mantra now.

 

I don't know what to tell you about what you saw on there being a shortage of IT people. That's a crock as far as I'm concerned. I've read nothing in trade magazines that says that nor has it been reflected in the lives of anyone I know, including my own.

I've been looking for a year now, and I have a little more than a year's experience and an MCSE, MCDBA, CCNA, and an A+, and I still can't find a job. I've had quite a few interviews during that time span too, but I have consistently lost the jobs to people with more experience than I have. What's that tell me? That there a lot of unemployed, experienced, IT people.

Your situation is not unique by any stretch of the imagination.

 

I think that personal contacts can play a big part in gaining employment, not just in IT, but anywhere really.

'Networking' with the right people can help to open doors. Joe who you used to work with in accounts may well be your best mate, and great for drinking with, but he's not likely to find help find you a new job is he?

An 'unofficial' reference can go a lot further than an official one.

 

I'm starting to agree with that. It was industry talking about "supposed" industry figures that had been released from govt sources (first error to believe anything they say).

I also agree that networking is a valuable tool, and no bad thing.

Ffreeloader, if you don't mind me asking, what line are you currently in? To "tide you over" until you manage to get work in IT?

 

LOL. I'm living up to my handle on this forum.

My wife works and I have a couple of small businesses for whom I do some consulting. I'm waiting right now for a call back from a software development business from whom I would get some pretty steady work doing their system administration a couple of days a week.

To tell the truth I've almost given up on getting into this field through the "normal" route of advancing in a career: finding an entry level job and working my way up. I did the same thing in my last career. I couldn't get my foot in the door no matter how hard I tried, so I started my own business. It turned into close to twenty years of enjoyable work.

I changed careers due to physical limitations. I have something very similar to rheumatoid arthritis or ankylosing spondylitis in my spine so my ability to do physical work is pretty limited. That's kept me out of several openings.

However, if the job market didn't favor employers so much right now I would have had a job several times because I know there were several jobs that I applied for, and interviewed for, that didn't require physical labor, but they went to guys with between 5 and 10 years experience. I was the only newbie interviewed in most of these situations too. I know, I asked. I will normally call an employer back after I get turned down to ask why they chose someone else, and how I need to improve my technical or soft skills to gain more of an advantage and it's simply boiled down to: the employer wouldn't have to spend as much time breaking in someone with several years of experience.

Not one employer said they turned me down due to lack of skills or a bad interview on my part. They all said it was lack of experience in a tight job market that has a lot of experienced people out of work.

 

I hear ya mate. I was recently offered some freelance software development for a local guy with a small business, really nice guy, we got on well, but I'm forced to use my wife's PC at the moment, to say it's a bit of a relic is an understatement, it would have been difficult to satisfy his business needs, so I will contact him when I will be of use to him, anything else is unfair. That said, as previously mentioned, it's all about networking.

 

That it is. The company that is really interested in me doing their system administration is a place where I went in to network, nothing else. I knew I wasn't qualified for what they wanted, but they do open source work and have Linux and FreeBSD servers I was interested. I've been talking to them off and on for more than 6 months now, and I've almost had a position there twice before. Something unrelated to me has happened with the business the other two times, so hopefully this one will work out.

Why have I had some success there? Because I made friends with someone on the inside who really started pulling for me, and even though he is now no longer with that company I know other people there I have made friends with. They are now trying to get me in the door.

Networking works wonders.

 

Again, agreed. I'm going to persevere, and learn as much as I can, have an area that I am more... able, then try to add other strings to my bow. Heck, I may even consider doing a PGCE, and going into teaching! The world always needs teachers right?

Actually, doing a teaching course, then being an IT teacher in say, a primary school (elementary school in the States I'm guessing), and then seeing what happens... Bizarre idea, but having ideas *POP* in there is fun.

I digress. I will network, persevere in my studies, and block out my exceptionally mundane, utterly unrewarding job in mortgages, and who knows.... Thanks fellas, I feel better already.

 

How many jobs have you applied for to date? How many on average per day? week?

How many different versions of your CV do you have? How many different versions of covering letter templates do you have?

How many agencies have you registered with?

Job hunting in IT is a full-time business, 8 hours a day, at least 5 days a week. It's tough. You have to graft hard, but it's do-able.

If you work at it full-time you may be lucky and get work within 3 months. At 6 weeks you are just beginning!

 

If you're unemployed go to the jobcentre and ask them. Ask if they have any IT courses and work placements. It worked for me.

 

Going on what I'm used to, it's a new experience finding work within a specific industry. I send roughly 5-10 CV's per week, and have joined half a dozen websites, and pestered 2 recruitment consultants this week. Like you say, it's almost a job in itself. I was just extremely hacked off at work today, far more so than normal.

Pete, I've been to the job centre, followed 4 or 5 leads, but they came to nothing.

So, key words, perseverance, networking, flexibility. Oh, and perhaps a little luck?

 

Balian

Hi - I know exactly what you feel like, I spent 11 years in the RN squeezing in 3 full sea drafts (T42's) in that time.

Not sure what you do in the mob but the only adavantage I may have had was that I was a computer maintainer and helped put in the first NT4 LAN's onto ships in refit. I did my first MCP's during my last sea draft with my wife sending out the study guides through the post.

I found the resettlement organisation useless (it may have improved since then) and basically had to sort myself out. I blitzed my CV everywhere etc etc - I got my first job through networking, I was chatting to a friend who mentioned he had a neighbour that worked in IT and might be looking for someone, I actually did the interview in his living room! It was the foothold I needed and after that things progressed nicely.

Keep grafting - I know from personal experience that the skills you will have gained are useful and will be of value when somebody takes you on -

Good luck

MarkN

 

Although I am employed myself and was fortunate to get the job I am in (Even though I actually hate it)... I understand exactly where you are coming from and am going to find myself in a similar situation to you I think...

Since starting my career in IT around 17/18 I am now on my 4th job (Which I intend to leave at the end of this year), and I am only 22 (23 this year).

It sounds quite bad in that statement but my first was an Modern Apprenticeship, and the 2nd was not a new job, but basically my boss owned 2 companies and I went to the other one...

But still it looks bad and the problem I have is moving up (Either in terms of pay or job)... I want to move up from desktop to server admin stuff, and its very very difficult to go up in an organisation nowadays, and in order for me to do that I have had to change job, because the current job has full time staff that do what I want to move in to, and they just can't afford to let me progress where I want to go, its understandable from their point of view, and mine.

When I applied for jobs before I got my current one, people asked me about previous history and they question my loyalty to an organisation...

But what am I the individual supposed to do about this? Stay in a company (Thereby showing loyalty) waiting for a guy who is currently in his mid 30's to retire or leave so I can then take the vacancy???

In all of my jobs so far I have not seen or heard of anyone who has gone up in terms of job positions in a even relatively quick timescale... vacancy's are made and external people fill them) I do not want to wait that long for things to happen!

What am I supposed to do....

 

Totally agree again mate. I think interviewers are also testing you, to see how you handle that question. I would have outlined exactly what you said about the advancement prospects, sure, wouldn't it be worse if you had no drive or ambition and stayed doing the same job at the same company for years and years and years.... It does seem you can't win sometimes.

Incidentally, I've just been offered a possible job working in IT recruitment. Never worked in recruitment before, but I wonder if it would actually be a foot in the door, or whether or not it's a white elephant....

Advice would be appreciated as per guys. Thanks...

 

Balian

See my previous post - coming from the same background I would advise you take the first decent offer you get, at least when you have something you have a bit of leeway when evaluating what to do next.

Mark

 

Shoot, sorry shipmate, just noticed you're ex mob too. I'm half tempted by the offer, I guess I could always use it to network too. Plus, there's a much better renumeration package, plus other perks availble too.

T42's eh?? *Shudders*... I had the mighty Iron Duck, and the Ocean. That's what you get for being a Guz rating... Well, at least in the end. I was an OM(EW), managed to do a fair bit of computer maintenance work on board, did a lot of work with the tiffs. Hope it counts for something.

 

yep - I'd take them up on the offer, at least it gives you something to go to.

Good old Guz! Refitted the Glasgow down there - bit of a shock for a dyed in the wool Pompey rating.

Did the OM operator maintainer idea work out? I joined as a WEM before doing the tiff's course, the first OM's were doing the first sea drafts as I was leaving, being on a batch 1 42 we were still having the ops\we split.