People who can't get a job in IT, ask yourselves why?

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OK, I was just on the message boards of my training provider and some dude has posted a message complaining that he was turned down for an entry level tech position. He is 51, with no experience etc. However, he also mentioned that until he heard the other candidates talking about it, he had no idea there was a new version of Windows due out and he had never even looked at a Windows Server OS. He struck me as one of the "I'll do IT for the money" people (who annoy me) so I've pasted my reply here, because I would be intersted in what other people think, and I think it is worth taking note if you are one of those people who are up against "real geeks" (in his words) for a job.

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Ummm.... I guess my only comment would be to wonder how you could suggest that a guy in an IT training program that specializes in Windows products could possibly not have a practical need for a Windows Server OS.

 

What I meant was, he may not need an actual server set up at home for day-to-day usage as opposed to for training and test purposes.

 

Ah, so you don't think there is a practical day-to-day use for an actual server when someone is studying for a MS cert? I'm sort of surprised....

 

what's wrong with doing infotech for the money? i'm the first to admit that i'm doing infotech just for the money. i think i'm reasonably good at what i do, and to a certain extent i enjoy my work, but it's definitely not where my heart is at all. i personally don't think that doing a certain job just for the money is necessarily a bad thing.

 

Behave Freddy, you know what I mean. A single user with a single computer doesn't need a file server to store his files but having one set up to practice on is a good idea. If you come back with another "witty" retort, I will hunt you down and kill you .

 

Let me ask you this d, if your heart isn't in it, why do you hang around here, why waste your spare time on something you have no interest in outside of the financial rewards? I used to fry chicken for a living, and my heart definitely wasn't in that but I didn't hang around www.chickenfryerscertifcationforums.co.uk in my free time either.

 

I'd say you're the exception not the rule, d-Faktor. The vast majority of the noobs you see wanting to get into IT because they think it's going to be the route to instant wealth and fabulous riches will never hack it because they will hate the hours, the constant learning, the stress, etc... because they made their decision based upon some phony picture of IT floated by the training companies.

They're the ones who see no problems with braindumping--because it's easier than learning and it's a shortcut, they think, to all that money that is just beyond their grasp at the moment.

Now, while IT may not be your first love, you do have some passion for it too. If you didn't you wouldn't be hanging out in newbies forums helping people. You would be doing anything but IT related things in your time away from work. While IT may not be your first passion, it has to be up there quite a ways on your list of things you are passionate about, or you wouldn't spend your free time at it too....

 

LOL.

I wouldn't say having a server to practice on is just a "good idea". I'd say it is a practical necessity for anyone trying to get into IT.

I was just curious to see if you would end up saying that having the proper tools to learn with are a must or not. I'm surprised that you didn't.

 

I would say this Freddy, having the proper tools to learn with are a must or not.

 

LOL.

[rant]I hate these minimum character requirements for posts.[/rant]

 

please don't think that certforums is the only forum i visit. not by far. there are other forums that are neither tech nor cert related that i visit much more often than this place.

and i didn't say i had no interest in the infotech business. sure i have an interest. and i also like to share what little experience and knowledge i gained over the years. but that doesn't mean i am or have to be passionate about it. i don't eat, drink and sleep technology.

so yes, i do like what i do, but i have other interests as well. over the years they have evolved more into hobbies, but given the choice i would rather pursue those as a career, and continue technology as a hobby. but the matter of fact is that it was much easier and much more profitable to get a job in the infotech business. and life goes on, bills have to be paid, so the opportunist in me went for the infotech world.

 

That's fair enough, in an ideal world I would be a rock climbing instructor but the pay is crap and I'm nowhere near good enough. But you do have some interest in the subject so you aren't really the type of people I was referring to. I meant people who have never turned on a PC in their lives and one day think "I know, I do that because I hear it's good money" and then, like the guy in my original post, don't follow the industry, are completely unaware of what's happening in the IT world and then complain they can't find work. If you were interviewing him for a tech support role and he said "Windows Vista? What's that then? By the way, I've never looked at a server OS." would you have given him the job? I certainly wouldn't even if knowledge of either of those things was directly related to the job in the same way I wouldn't give a mechanic who had never looked at a diesel engine a job.

 

Let me add a wrinkle that it's not always any fault of the applicant as to why they don't get a job.

I get a call from a software company that makes specializied software for tablet pc's for hostipals. This was a network administrator position. Now, this interview process laster 2 1/2 weeks, from the initial face-to-face to a lot of "what would you do" situations, to the final job and salary offer. They told me I beat out three other candidates because if I didn't know the answer to something, I told then I didn't know rather than trying to BS my way through it.

Anyway, I get the job offer, handsome salary, etc.etc., but I still have to talk it over with the wife and we come up with a 4-question list of HR issues (401k, insurance deductions, other benefits, etc). So I call them back and get voice mail. No big deal, they are very busy. Three days and many emails later (delivery and read request) I still don't have any information although I got my read receipts on all my emails. FINALLY I get a reply from the IT manager I interviewed with:

Luckally I hadn't officially accepted the position nor turned in my notice with my current emplorer.

PS...I'm running VMware with Server 2003 and 4 clients in a virtual network for MCSE training.

 

Looks like the person in question in my original post has just joined up. Looks like he took some of what I had to say on board .

 

Good for him! I hope Tony learns something from CF!

I know what you mean about people just doing it for the money, they crash and burn!

One of my mates told me about this bloke who took out a career development loan to do a course in MCSE. The Learning provider also offers a cousre in plumbing.

Well his heart was not in it, he tried to cheat and that didn't pay off. Then he read about plumbers being on 45K a year so he switch course to do plumbing.

But failed!

He took at another loan out and has skipped the country and from I have been told he is £25K in debt and owes his ex-girlfriend some money too.

I've been told he's living in Mexico. I'm not sure what's the IT industry is like over there or what jobs are available.

But it is a lesson to be learned. If you are doing IT for the money and have no interest in IT. Then you are in the wrong Place!

Monkey

 

i have to agree with all the parties in this thread.. like d says if IT is going to pay the bills a little easier in a few years time when you have a good footing in IT then why not? Again i agree with baba you need to have a passion to make it.. i started off on peanuts here in cyprus (if i told you what im earning in a year you lot would curse me!) but i kept on doing it because i knew to make it to where i want to be in my career i would have to work my butt off! If you not passionate about IT i dont think you will make it very far...

Oh and i got a Server running in my room - just to keep the flow going there...

PS if baba wanted to make it into rock climbing i nearly made into pro tennis.. yip.. only my knee packed up..

 

About this just doing it for the money thing, I don't just have these feelings about IT. I know many people who hate their jobs but don't have the skillset to do anything else so they just stay there because they can earn more than starting out in a different career. I feel sorry for anyone in that position because work is basically one third of your life, if you hate one third of your life, that's pretty sad I think. I would much rather be doing a job I love for free than a job I hate for £50k. Unfortunately, like everyone else, I still have bills to pay.

 

Well said Baba

 

monkey stole the words out of my mouth! i think the way to work out who is in for the money and who isnt are the people who have been on this forum for atleat a year - heard everyone say the market is dead and people not finding jobs and they still slugging away to make it into IT - thats passion.