New role salary expectations

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Hi everyone,

I am currently a local support analyst.

This tax year there has been a re-org of the structure at my work, with people moving all over the place my senior local support guy moved to security and his position opened up. I applied for this, but as is the way with my employer I was turned down b/c someone else on the team had already been earmarked for this job (its the way they do internal promotions), after being told that I wasn't going to be taken forward for an interview because of x excuse I was a bit angry and had a word with my line manager saying that I understood they wanted so&so for this job and i'm aware of how they do things but I was now worried about the path to move up for me being kinda blocked.

A little while ago I was told, good news, we're going to open another senior local support role and we would like you to fill it, brilliant, I have the 'interview' tomorrow but I'm starting to get a bit wary of being shafted on the pay side of things.

Completely accidently (honestly) I overheard how much the other Senior Local Support guy is on the other day.....and its a good deal more than me, at the very top of the pay band for this job, 7k pa more infact, now i do the exact same job as him (as i've been taking on more since it was decided I was filling the new post) to as good if not better standard, i seem to be taking on more responsibility by the day, but i've got this horrible feeling that i'm going to be paid a good deal less than someone else with the exact same job title and role, i think he got top whack because he was previously contracting here (doing my current job) on a good rate and would have just said, I'm not going perm unless you make it worth my while. My feeling is that they know my wage, 20k, and are never going to even think about putting me in at 7k more than that, given how i felt that the salary was non-negoitable the last time I was in this position I think that my big boss is gonna take a just as hardball approach and table like a 22-23k take it or leave it kinda offer, or at least an offer with a very ascertive, this is what we're giving you, attitude!

This is my thoughts on the matter:

- They obv want me to stick around, my reputation here is as good as it gets and i know i'm valued, I think because of that they didnt like knocking me back for the original role and in an effort to keep me here have broke their structure and opened another role for me (there was prev only 1 senior local support pos, this has been filled by ex-contracter and they have now opened another one for no obv reason apart from to move me up)

- This gives me a good chance to get a nice pay rise, and get me to the 25k+ level for the first time since I left the army. But at the same time, thats still less than my colleague is getting for the exact same role but at the same time is still a huge rise for me so I'm not sure they will offer 25k+ as they can offer 23k and feel that they are rewarding me with an extra 3k.....he's being greedy if he wants more than that kinda thing.

- Is saying that I know his wage a taboo thing, like can I just come out with, I know x is on 27k why have you only offered me 23 (for some reason this is the expected figure I have in my head lol) i feel i'm worth the same and have huge value for you blah blah blah

- I wish negotiating pay was not a part of life as i have never done it before and I am rubbish at it.

Does anyone have any advice they can give me on this, i have 25k in my head as an amount I would be happy with, despite the fact that my colleague is on more (is this a bad attitude), thats a decent rise for me and would increase my standard of living i think, i'm just worried theyre going to come out with 23k and i'm going to take it like a ballbag and be earning 2/3's the salary of someone who's doing the same job!

 

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Just because you know his salary doesn't necessarily mean you should be on the same, i earn less than one of the guys at work who does the same job as me - but he's got tons more experience than me and has more qualifications - i can't expect to be on the same as him.

With all due respect, how do you know you're better at your job than him? if you were all that better, then wouldn't they have given you the job first time round?

I'm not saying the above to be annoying or a ****, but it's just how i understand it after reading your post.

I'd go in and see what they offer you, they may give you the same as him, or it may be slightly less - either way, they've got a reason for paying him his wage at what it is.

Does the chap have any certifications, and how much experience has he got within IT?

 

Thanks for your reply, I'm on the mobile and ready to go home so will answer more later but , he got the role over me because he was contracted in and they are currently cutting down on contractors by either getting them in perm or getting rid.

That's why I didn't get the first job, they wanted to get him off outsourced contractor rates but keep him onboard, the role was his all along and imo the fact theyve created an identical role to move me into shows that they see us as some sort of equals.

 

If they did think of you as equals wouldn't they have offered you the job for less money than they're paying him and got rid of him? Business is business after all.
I'd be careful about letting them know you know how much he is earning. I'd be suspicious as to how you came by that knowledge, did you really overhear it?? I don't think you can prove it one way or the other so maybe best to keep quiet on that, some people might think you'e been poking around where you shouldn't. Maybe you misheard, maybe the person you overheard had wrong information. It seems like a huge can of worms to open.

Best to keep that info to yourself I think. Whatever offer they make you will tell you a lot but do keep in mind that managers have budgets to look after and they may not be able to stretch it as far as you'd like initially, although I'd be looking to have some sort of timescale for moving me forward to the top whack.

 

I know it sounds a bit like a bs excuse for knowing his pay, and I see where your coming from re: not saying anything when you think of it like that, but we have a big open plan office and my colleague had some dramas with his first months pay so I overheard my boss on the desk next to me confirming with the payroll what band and level he was on for them to sort his wages out, gods honest truth.

Yes they possibly could have got rid of him, but at the same time as wanting to cut down hugely on the contracting outgoings, they are also having a manning problem, if they got rid of him and moved me up they'd in effect be losing 2 guys in our team and the one guy left would never be able to cope with that!

In response to some other points which I never answered earlier.

He has no IT certs, from my conversations with him he's got a lot of exp doing rollouts, and this role was his first doing a proper 2nd line job, he does have a good general knowledge of IT and, like me, was completely cruising the role he has just left, the difference between us is that he has been here for 3 years and only just went permanent now, whereas I was here for 6 months before I pushed to get made permanent and less than 6 months later i'm being moved up into a senior role, our whole team has taken on more responsibility from the server guys as a direct result of me personally trying to get more responsibility, when i got there the 2 guys in place were always phoning the third line guys to recreate profiles for them, add printers to the dhcp server etc, i'd been there about 2 months when (knowing that I knew how to do all that, just didnt have permisions on the servers) started asking if i could be given more rights so that I could do xx job and stop having to hassle the 3rd line guys for it, after a few emails around its decided that the whole team can have their rights changed and we can start doing w/e instead of phoning up 3rd line, i believe that things like this is what sets me apart from him and possibly puts me into the category of performing better, so i know my op sounds like i'm blowing my own trumpet but i really am awesome at my job and dying for more responsibility and diversion from the regular 2nd line calls

 

Aren't you now going to be left with 1 guy anyway if you're both doing the same job?

You've said it there, 3 years experience in the job, whilst it's a long time for a contracting role, the company must be seeing soemthing there.

This is IT, the competition for roles in companies is huge - it's just part of the industry, and unfortunately you're going to get it anywhere you go working in IT, i'm pretty sure many people on this forum have had the same thing when applying for a new job internally.

The other alternative is to pack up and look for a new job. At the end of the day, if you've got a step up into a senior role, look at what it's doing for your experience, if you plan on having a career in IT, you aren't going to be on good money until after several different roles and years worth of exprience, it doesn't all come straight off

 

Sorry to be harsh but don't compare what you're earning with anyone else because it always ends badly.

I have experienced in the past jobs where people are on considerably more than their peers, the reasons for this we experience rather than qualifications.

Any bump in salary is good for you, for you to start questioning why x is earning more than y is an easy way to get you thrown out of a position (you should know from your Army days never to discuss differences, whether that was annual reports or pay).

You have two choices here, accept the role and increase or move on, if you let the fact that your colleague earns more than you get into your head then you're going to go into a gentle decline because you're going to think f**k it, why should I bother.

The fact that your company are willing to create a role to keep you 'should' be reward enough, it shows that the company think highly enough of you to do that, they could simply have left you at the position you were at but they didn't.

Don't look a gift horse in the mouth!!