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Very confused and stressed!!!

Discussion in 'General Cisco Certifications' started by network_guy, Apr 16, 2008.

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  1. network_guy

    network_guy Bit Poster

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    Hi everyone, I registered to this forum in hopes that someone may enlighten me as to what exactly is going on with the Cisco CCNA examinations.

    My country of residence is Canada. I am not sure whether certifications are standard internationally, although I suppose they are since "Pearson Vue" supplies them and they comply with Cisco standards.

    For the past couple weeks I have been studying for Cisco CCNA intro Exam (640-821) and INCD as well. I was going to take the exams one at a time. Yesterday, I went to a test center (a.k.a: $$$ training center $$$) to take my exam. Anyhow, after 1 full hour of trying to belittle me and suck me into one of they're training programs which cost a bundle, and after another half hour of telling them which Cisco exam I wanted to take, they told me the Cisco CCNA has been changed, I pointed them to the Cisco exam 640-821 which is the intro for the hundredth time and after registering half-way, a notice was displayed asking for a number to some type of "Cisco Academy". Anyhow, as confused as these people were, I was even more confused, I studied weeks for these exams and my stress level went up a notch after having no answers as to what the helk transpired here. I went to the Cisco website and it stated Cisco CCNA exams have been "Retired since Nov 2007", I'm assuming that means they were discontinued and are not valid any longer. I have called up many other places and they are telling me I can take my CCNA intro exam, I don't know whats going on any longer...CAN SOMEONE PLEASE EXPLAIN TO ME WHAT IS GOING ON AND CAN I TAKE MY CCNA INTRO AND IF NOT WHAT CCNA EXAM CAN I TAKE ? PLEASE HELP ME...IM GOING NUTS

    Thanks for any input here!!!
     
  2. BosonMichael
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    BosonMichael Yottabyte Poster

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    All your questions are answered directly on the Cisco Web site, which you have already seen.

    So what can you take? You can take the new ICND1 and ICND2 exams, which will get you the CCNA certification. You cannot take the old INTRO or ICND exams unless you are currently enrolled in a Cisco Academy course, and I'm not sure how long that "grace period" will be offered before those students have to switch.

    You don't need to take a Cisco Academy training course. All you need to do is study for the ICND1 and ICND2 exams (one at a time is recommended), visit www.vue.com to register for your exam, and show up at the testing center at your assigned time... no need to speak with ANYONE at the testing center other than to say, "I'm here to take an exam."
     
    Certifications: CISSP, MCSE+I, MCSE: Security, MCSE: Messaging, MCDST, MCDBA, MCTS, OCP, CCNP, CCDP, CCNA Security, CCNA Voice, CNE, SCSA, Security+, Linux+, Server+, Network+, A+
    WIP: Just about everything!
  3. sunn

    sunn Gigabyte Poster

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    Just to clear things up, because I'm in Canada too, what BM said is valid for us Canucks 8).
    Check out the Cisco site for exam details. Specifically, the CCNA path via the CCENT is made up of the 640-822 ICND1 & 640-816 ICND2.

    As for studying outdated material, I wouldn't worry about it. I'm sure most of the topics and concepts are same with some modifications. Pick up a book that covers the new exam material and you should be fine.

    Good Luck with studying... :study
     
  4. network_guy

    network_guy Bit Poster

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    Hi, thank you BM and sunn for the replies.

    Anyhow, I just have one final question. If I go take the INCD1 test having studied for CCNA intro, should I expect something entirely/somewhat different? What additional material could be missing from the CCNA intro that is on the INCD1 exam. I know the Cisco website provides the outline for the INCD1 exam, the only thing I see extra in the INCD1 is more on WLAN, but if anyone has taken the CCNA intro and then the INCD1, from your experience how much different are they? I don't want to purchase new materials for the INCD1 knowing that I only have to catch up on some more details on WLAN. Thank you again for any response, much appreciated!


    ( In correspondence to the training center, thats exactly what I specified, I was there only to take the exam, nothing more. I did not ask about they're training programs etc...I simply wanted to get my certificate. Instead, they asked me all kinds of questions, where I studied before, if I had any training, how could I advance while taking they're training courses etc...At first I thought this was part of the procedure so I politely went with the flow but I specifically asked just to take the test, when I told them I have a degree in Computer and Networking they told me I still need to update to windows server 2008, Vista etc...I finally lost my patience and told them they shouldn't care as it wasn't they're business, I got out of there triple time once they told me I couldn't take the CCNA intro. )
     
  5. network_guy

    network_guy Bit Poster

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    Thanks....I love studying especially! :) ...

    /sarcasm
     
  6. network_guy

    network_guy Bit Poster

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    Actually, I made a decision (not that anyone cares but here it is)...I'm sort of happy Cisco came out with the CCENT exams. If I get these certs I'm pretty much up to date with all the material for another 3-4 years minimum. If I got my CCNA intro before it retired it wouldn't look that great on a resume (to the employer) but the CCENT INCD1 and 2 would.

    Thanks for your replies, I just found a INCD1/INCD2 torrent package and don't have to purchase any new material.
     
  7. BosonMichael
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    Ab-so-lutely. Cisco analyzed their old INTRO and ICND exams and realized that the INTRO exam had all the easy CCNA stuff and the ICND exam had all the hard CCNA stuff. Thus, nobody was going the 2-exam route... the risk of getting hung up on the ICND exam was too great. So Cisco reshuffled the CCNA objectives for a more even distribution of difficulty between the two exams. Thus... the INTRO book is probably going to miss a lot of stuff they've shuffled around.

    They so totally want to sell you some expensive training. Avoid that and register on VUE's website. :)
     
    Certifications: CISSP, MCSE+I, MCSE: Security, MCSE: Messaging, MCDST, MCDBA, MCTS, OCP, CCNP, CCDP, CCNA Security, CCNA Voice, CNE, SCSA, Security+, Linux+, Server+, Network+, A+
    WIP: Just about everything!
  8. BosonMichael
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    Dude... that's piracy... blatant copyright infringement. Know that several of us on here are published authors who make their living from book and training product sales. Stealing our stuff from torrents literally takes food from our kids' mouths.

    If it's worth using, it's worth buying. Consider it an investment in your career.
     
    Certifications: CISSP, MCSE+I, MCSE: Security, MCSE: Messaging, MCDST, MCDBA, MCTS, OCP, CCNP, CCDP, CCNA Security, CCNA Voice, CNE, SCSA, Security+, Linux+, Server+, Network+, A+
    WIP: Just about everything!
  9. network_guy

    network_guy Bit Poster

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    Hey thanks for your replies, its worth mentioning that I did purchase my CCNA intro and INCD package at Chapters (this Canadian book place). I paid somewhere around 100 dollars for the whole package, and I think purchasing the INCD1 and INCD2 books would be unfair to me because a) the book place should not have been selling it since its retired and b) I did not get the chance to utilize the knowledge from that and take the CCNA exams c) now I have to recompile my knowledge by re-reading the material and spending another 2 long weeks digesting it until the exam

    I purchase all my books atleast 99 percent of the time because I don't like PDF files and rather like to take notes down in the books pages. I am fair, and I think that considering my honesty, downloading this package won't have major impact on Cisco press authors since I already put money in they're pockets from previous purchases while others (probably thousands of them) never had. I promise when I become CCIE I will help out the authors in the development of new Cisco texts.

    Thanks again for the previous replies!!!
     
  10. BosonMichael
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    Doesn't matter - it's still piracy. The ICND1 and ICND2 books are different from the INTRO and ICND books. It's not Cisco Press's fault that you didn't do your homework; the exam retirement was made known around the middle of last year. Thus, if you want to use their stuff, you should pay the money.

    The book place isn't gonna keep track of certifications to see if they're current. If YOU didn't know they were retired, how would you expect an employee in a book store to know?

    Following your logic:

    I bought Call of Duty 2, but I didn't know Call of Duty 4 was out for the PC! How dare the game store sell it to me? So I just downloaded it from a torrent. After all, Activision already got their money for Call of Duty 2... why should I have to pay for Call of Duty 4???

    I don't think it's fair that I have to drive a '99 Altima with three hubcaps, so I think I'll go take an '07 Altima from the car lot. :rolleyes:

    If you're truly honest, do the right thing.
     
    Certifications: CISSP, MCSE+I, MCSE: Security, MCSE: Messaging, MCDST, MCDBA, MCTS, OCP, CCNP, CCDP, CCNA Security, CCNA Voice, CNE, SCSA, Security+, Linux+, Server+, Network+, A+
    WIP: Just about everything!
  11. network_guy

    network_guy Bit Poster

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    My logic is reasonable to me, but I bet its unreasonable to many. I paid a lot for education, over 18 thousand dollars of it while one of your Cisco buddies at the office (wearing tie, a Rolex watch and driving a Ferrari) is telling me to go shove the diploma in the tin can. Now, I have to pay off a monthly mortgage with no job, no certificates, no money and a fatcat boss telling me I got nothing to offer and if I did it would be for minimum wage, else I end up on the street. How is that logic sound to you? (I might just end up writing a C program at the EOF). I could have not mentioned anything at all, and could have lied that I'm purchasing the books etc... I have no money for gas much less another 100 dollars for a textbook and a exam I have to pay for that once again may or may not get me a job. So 18000 to pay off in OSAP, 1000 to pay off monthly mortgage, jobless, my diploma to employers seems to be synonymous with toilet paper and minimal experience in the field.

    How delightful this is...
     
  12. network_guy

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    So let me see, if that were true then they wouldn't be selling Windows 95 textbooks would they? If not, why not? I mean, obviously the employees wouldn't know anything so that means they should still be up there. If bookstores didn't know when books weren't valid any longer they would still be selling books on how to build room sized computational devices using vacuum tubes. The fact is there is some rules and regulations when keeping track of books especially with IT books which change quite often. I am no author, I imagine when a author releases his books, he does so at certain times etc...In that case, the author should have specified that the book is not valid any longer (specify approx time to warn customers etc...), to prevent stealing money from the buyers (which is exactly what the author or bookstore is doing in this IT related case, its selling books that belong in the trash can) . But the simple fact is that the bookstores would go bankrupt if they sold outdated material. They sold me outdated material, whether or not they meant too or not. Its not my fault, I expect the latest books to be out there on the shelf, if I wanted to get outdated books I'd go to my nearest library...thnx
     
  13. greenbrucelee
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    Good point Rep give for quoting the truth.

    Mate it doesn't matter how much you have paid for education or that you don't have a job or enough money. Stealing is stealing.

    I left school at 16 with not very good grades, I found a youth training scheme which was free in which I learned I was good on computers. I got £30 a week doing this as it was through the dole office, I was lucky enough to get a grant to help study a GNVQ in IT at a local college. I was then approached by the head of the IT dept saying I should go to uni and do a HND then further it on to a degree.

    I had to use my own money for this a subsequently got into thousands of pounds worth of debt. I left uni in 1999 I never got an IT job as I was in so much financial problems I couldn't do anything but move back home with my Mum.

    I got my self a job which I am still in 8 years ago, I do things with IT but not in the capacity I would like and will only finish my debt repayments in 15 days time.

    Whilst still in this financial mess I decided to get some certs although I still have no cash so thought I'll self study & when I can afford I'll take the exams

    My point of this story is I have no cash, not a job I really enjoy but I would never steal or cheat my way to a certification.

    If it takes me 1 year to get a job in IT with certs by stealing/cheating or 20 years to get an IT job and some certs doing it properly I'll do it properly.
     
    Certifications: A+, N+, MCDST, Security+, 70-270
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  14. greenbrucelee
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    BTW my local Waterstones sells The complete guide to Windows 98SE and you can even get a book on OS2 warp :blink
     
    Certifications: A+, N+, MCDST, Security+, 70-270
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  15. network_guy

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    Thats a good story (and I'm definitely feeling you)...but let me get this straight. So basically, by your logic I have to wait 20 years to get a certificate and end up (in the present tense) on the street? Thats not a very good plan Bruce, I expected more from you. I know you were just analogizing but the fact remains that time is a great factor for me. I'm not here to talk about the situation I am in anyhow, I just think plenty of you underestimate peoples situation and jump to outrageous conclusions of committing some sort of violent crime (ie: the Ferrari driving, Rolex wearing "business" men). How about your aborting wives or girlfriends? Are you going to protest against that as well, I hope you will, thats not a Cisco textbook in there, thats a valued human life...I can understand you Bruce, but I can't understand top-notch arrogance. There are millions of people pirating right now, you name it, music, movies, books, software etc... If everyone is such an angel on these forums, then please tell me why haven't you protested with the other millions of angels who are against pirating. Why jump at me like a cat from the bush? Let me tell you something about Pirating, you do it, I do it and everyone else does it...and the reason:::-> because they can.


    P.S: I'll steal from Bill Gates anyday 8)
     
  16. greenbrucelee
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    I am not making you ot to be Mr bad guy, I am just trying as BM is to hep you see that it's wrong to do it the way you want.

    Yes I had copied videos when I was very young probably about 13/14 or something but I havent done it since then.

    My cousing thought I was pirating the other day as I download the Sountpark episodes the day after the broadcast on comedy central in the US. But under the current contract terms of the makers of Southpark with comedy central (Trey Parker & Matt Stone) this is how they want it free to view so that wasn't pirating.

    We all stuggle and yes it can be frustrating but it makes you a better person in the long run and anyway just because you get a cert doesn't make you any more employable. If you have no commercial experience getting Cisco certs is likley to damage your employment prospects.
     
    Certifications: A+, N+, MCDST, Security+, 70-270
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  17. network_guy

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    Let me tell you something Bruce, I have been a very honest person in my lifetime, I bet more honest then most people I met or you met in your life. And guess what, that has essentially gotten me nowhere, my "Mr. Niceguy" attitude has put me on the brink of extinction. I'm no idiot either, all my marks in school were above 75's and averaged 85 in core courses, this was one of the hardest programs in my College, second to Computer Engineering which I had to take half of. That 2 year diploma program which I completed last year is now sliding towards the edge of the cliff. Those brutally honest individuals at school took me on a path that has little credulity in the IT world, and at the same time they managed to slip away 18g's worth down to my slippers.

    You could say that I'm mad...and I am quite mad, mad people do things which non-mad people don't.


    P.S: Of course it makes you more employable Bruce, imagine someone with no experience, what else could that employer look for if not a combination of either experience and certificates or just certificates or just experience. Is it knowledge? Of course it is and certs and experience gives you that credibility of being knowledgeable. Could it be the looks perhaps? I dunno about that one Bruce, why would they care about that? Bruce, this is going nowhere, I am about half-way done downloading my Cisco material and I'm smiling while the bits and bytes flow from the head end downstream to my modem, to my router and finally to my NIC card, to the buffer, through the m/b bus lines, eventually being written to my hard-drive...its a wonderful feeling don't you know?

    And I paid for it as well, I paid the ISP for the 1 Gigabit speed, I guess the Cisco stuff wasn't free after all.

    PPS:
    I have commercial experience Bruce, if you mean commercial as in with "actual" Cisco routers and switches, thats affirmative. Cisco certs are not only for Cisco products Bruce, its to give you good knowledge of Networking in general and it stands out on a resume. You may not be allowed to touch that 25000 dollar gateway Router locked up in chains but your one step closer to getting there. But most importantly, your one step closer to getting that job that deals with Cisco products, but at the same time doesn't have too.
     
  18. network_guy

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    Bruce, I'm not here to insult people, I appreciate all the suggestions and input from all the members here, good or bad. I'm not a pirate, I haven't burned a torrent ISO in the past 6-7 years. I haven't even downloaded much music lately but if I found the music was truly inspiring then I would most likely purchase the soundtrack from the source. In terms of the Cisco material, its a matter of getting what I paid for, I paid not for the books, I paid for getting information necessary to complete my Cisco examination. If I had completed my examination when the exam was still valid, I would have went down to the bookstore afterwards and picked up a bunch of study material for CCNP. Once I get these exams done, I'm going to march down to the bookstore and pick up plenty of Cisco texts knowing that they will take me somewhere where I initially wanted to go.
     
  19. BosonMichael
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    So... you decide that it's OK steal MY work because you decided to get a degree? :blink

    I got a degree too. Should I steal as well?

    For the record, your degree isn't worthless. It helps give you an advantage over your competition... but it won't allow you to skip rungs of the IT ladder. For example, it'll help you get an entry-level job... but it won't automagically make you a network administrator.
     
    Certifications: CISSP, MCSE+I, MCSE: Security, MCSE: Messaging, MCDST, MCDBA, MCTS, OCP, CCNP, CCDP, CCNA Security, CCNA Voice, CNE, SCSA, Security+, Linux+, Server+, Network+, A+
    WIP: Just about everything!
  20. BosonMichael
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    Some *do* sell Windows 95 books. Know why they're not on the shelves in most bookstores anymore? The book publishers stop producing them and listing them. When the last copy is sold, no more can be ordered. The copy you bought had likely sat on the shelf for months.

    The author has no control over whether a book is published... that's the publisher's job. And the publisher, Cisco Press, had stopped printing the old books. Your bookstore had old copies sitting on the shelf.

    Eh, once you get out in the workplace, you'll understand how business works. Someday you may create something that someone steals and then you'll realize how it is when the shoe is on the other foot.
     
    Certifications: CISSP, MCSE+I, MCSE: Security, MCSE: Messaging, MCDST, MCDBA, MCTS, OCP, CCNP, CCDP, CCNA Security, CCNA Voice, CNE, SCSA, Security+, Linux+, Server+, Network+, A+
    WIP: Just about everything!

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