1. This site uses cookies. By continuing to use this site, you are agreeing to our use of cookies. Learn More.

Training provider or self study??

Discussion in 'Training & Development' started by Lostboy, May 6, 2007.

  1. Lostboy

    Lostboy New Member

    3
    0
    18
    Hi!

    I have only just joined up to CF and would realy appreciate some help, this subject has probably been covered here a dozen times before and I will be having a look but any extra info from anyone who has been in a similar situation will be received gratefully.:D

    I have used computers for years to some extent but now I want to learn all there is and hopefully turn it into a career. I have set my sights on the compTIA A+ certification as a start with the aim of getting a foothold in the IT industry, then hopefully move onto further creditation like N+ and cisco. Im having trouble deciding on my next move. Do I go for a training provider (I've been looking at skillstrain and advent) or do I go for it on my own????

    My 2 main reason for considering a TP are the recruitment services they offer and the hands-on practical experience it is claimed they provide. I have never worked in IT before and would like a course that offers genuine classroom tuition along with theory.

    I had an interview with a skillstrain saleswoman and she claimed to have me in a work placement as soon as A+ is passed. Does anyone have experience of this from any TP??

    Thanks for reading all!!!!:biggrin

    [mod edit bluerinse - post approved]
     
    WIP: A+
  2. Bluerinse
    Honorary Member

    Bluerinse Exabyte Poster

    8,871
    167
    256
    Hi there lostboy,

    You will find out, if you take the time to read some of the past threads in the training and development forum that most of the veterans to certification here promote self study as opposed to going with a training provider. The reasons for this are many and varied but number one is that you will save a bucket load of money and the potential for disappointment is avoided.

    Do a search on here for the names of the providers you listed and make your own mind up.

    I used a training provider in Australia and i really wish i hadn't, as i quickly realised that the material that is covered in the courses does not even get close to preparing you for the related exams. You will end up doing most of the learning on your own, regardless of whether you go on a course or not. Oh and they went out of business half way through my MCSE!

    I have read way too many horror stories from people attending various training providers, that i am now very leery of all of them. If you do decide to go with one, please, for your own sake, do proper research! - don't be hoodwinked by what their respective sales people preach, most of it is hogwash, as they are salespeople after all.

    Good luck,

    Pete
     
    Certifications: C&G Electronics - MCSA (W2K) MCSE (W2K)
  3. BosonMichael
    Highly Decorated Member Award

    BosonMichael Yottabyte Poster

    19,136
    462
    374
    Another vote for self study. :)
     
    Certifications: CISSP, MCSE+I, MCSE: Security, MCSE: Messaging, MCDST, MCDBA, MCTS, OCP, CCNP, CCDP, CCNA Security, CCNA Voice, CNE, SCSA, Security+, Linux+, Server+, Network+, A+
    WIP: Just about everything!
  4. onoski

    onoski Terabyte Poster

    3,120
    51
    154
    Welcome to CF and go the self study route as you'd learn a lot that way and it shows initiative.
     
    Certifications: MCSE: 2003, MCSA: 2003 Messaging, MCP, HNC BIT, ITIL Fdn V3, SDI Fdn, VCP 4 & VCP 5
    WIP: MCTS:70-236, PowerShell
  5. Headache

    Headache Gigabyte Poster

    1,092
    9
    85
    Agreed. Self study all the way.
     
    Certifications: CCNA
    WIP: CCNP
  6. derkit

    derkit Gigabyte Poster

    1,479
    54
    112
    I've only taken 1 exam - and I'm voting or self-study all the way also.
     
    Certifications: MBCS, BSc(Hons), Cert(Maths), A+, Net+, MCDST, ITIL-F v3, MCSA
    WIP: 70-293
  7. Arroryn
    Honorary Member

    Arroryn we're all dooooooomed

    4,009
    186
    209
    Although I do advocate self-study, as I am with a training provider myself I'm throwing in the side from the other side of the fence.

    Training providers are expensive. Flat. No argument. But they should always come with a 0% finance option as the load is for study purposes; Skillstrain, certainly, provide this.

    However, read between the lines. For their fee, Skillstrain will pay for you to sit all of your exams once. They will not pay for any resits, so make sure as damn that you pass first time. lol. When you map this out to real world costs, you get two A+ exams, the N+, and deciding on the course you are taking, you get full costs for CCNA and CCNP paths, too.

    They do provide work placements, through their affiliation with Monster. But remember, this may be far away from you geographically, and it may be at a low starting wage. Do not rely on this as a method of getting your first IT job. I did not use their 'job finding' facility. I didn't use their technical training either, though I will certainly be taking advantage of the Live Labs for the Cisco elements of my courses.

    Skillstrain have recently updated their material for the CompTIA courses and though their material does map well to objectives, I would always recommend anyone to buy another text to make sure you view things from another perspective.

    The benefit of a training provider (or college course) above self study is the motivational perspective. Not everyone can pull the books out and keep it going after a full day at work, and the TMAs or assignments given to you on a mapped course keep you focused on the next goal. I always knew I needed a periodal kick up the behind to remind me to stay on route.

    Many people don't go with training providers because they are put off by the press of them being expensive. Well, what do you expect? They're a business. But as above, coupled with the training material, if you stick the course all the way through you're going to get a fair bit of your cash back in refunded exam fees. These companies make their money by Joe Bloggs copping out of the course 3 months in and realising he's stuck in a contract, because the training providers are giving exactly what they said, whereas Joe B was expecting to sing and dance through a serious certification.

    Only you can decide which is the best route.

    Most of Certforums, and many more IT veterans, will recommend you to self study, and they do obviously have a point. But if you know that you find it difficult to stay focused, if you feel that you need tutor support, or you like the steady milestones that a course will provide, then training providers aren't always the devil's spawn. Just remember, you still need to put in the graft. They aren't just going to give you a certification, and they certainly won't refund you if you decide that 'it's not for you'.

    Whichever you decide, good luck 8)
     
    Certifications: A+, N+, MCDST, 70-410, 70-411
    WIP: Modern Languages BA
  8. Lostboy

    Lostboy New Member

    3
    0
    18
    Thanks for the advice guys, I think I probably am going to head down the self study route, at least for the A+ exams.

    I am just a little worried that employers won't consider the level of hands-on practical experience I will have by then enough to land my first job in IT. Does anyone here have experiences like this??

    Thanks again everyone, your advice is priceless!
     
    WIP: A+
  9. theskillsgap

    theskillsgap New Member

    6
    0
    1
    also as a training provider...the maths is simple
    book = cheaper route
    training = more expensive but time effective route

    also you get a lot more kudos and door openings if you have the official training under your belt,

    both companies you have mentioned bear no real difference from going to amazon, and getting some books so probably not a good company to put your future in the hands of, for the record, one of the companies (mm starts with the A) you have mentioned has some of the worst courseware i have ever seen...

    we are training an individual stitched up like a kipper by them...he's doing well with us tho...

    this site supports two different types of individuals self motivated academics, they''l always succeed..as they have their education to use as back up..

    there are also go getter -practical types...the motivation of self study will kill off a lump of potential in most..as you have a distinct lack of structured support.


    the industry has loads of "Bedroom Bandits" just make sure you're cv has the value in it an employer needs, not just certification, get some work placement or as i say - just find a good certified and authorised training partner..

    good luck fella

    justin:ohmy
     
  10. Deckerhobo

    Deckerhobo New Member

    4
    0
    1
    I attended a technical school to get my ASS. I thought I know something about computers, but as it turned out I didn’t. I spent 30K on an associate degree (F….!)

    The most frustrating thing about it is that after a few months of tech classes, I had gained the foundation that I needed to learn the rest on my own. I quickly passed my class mates by self study. Towards the end, I was studying for certs that I has not been to class for yet because I has already achieved the certs that I was in class for.

    I did finish the programs, but by the time I was two-thirds finished, the instructors had nothing to offer m besides a grade, Point is…

    If you have the foundation, and you truly do (I thought I did but had no clue), then self study is the way to go. I needed a push to fill in the blanks. If you need the push, spend the bucks; if not, self study is the way to go.
     
  11. GW

    GW Byte Poster

    119
    4
    39
    I was doing the self-study course myself for a while but it was really slow going. I joined up a small MCSE school near where I live that offered me a good deal of $4000 (course is nearly a year long) and were more than willing to adjust my course to allow me to take SQL instead of WinXP which I already passed the exam.

    One that made it a good choice for me is the fact that they had me wait three months before starting so I could join in with a more advanced group of people, most of them are working as System Engineers so it's a great class since we bring from work what is causing us problems and share with the class and learn from each other.

    GW
     
    Certifications: MCP x4, CompTia x3
    WIP: Cisco CCNA
  12. dee1810

    dee1810 Byte Poster

    142
    2
    29
    Hi

    I went with Scheidegger (SkillsTrain) and I could have got the course material cheaper.

    I had the terrible nightmare that IF I just bought a book that I would site down to do the exam, and find that I had the wrong questions.
    I also need to do the study at home (which I call self-study), but when I got stuck, I would need a human to ask questions. I needed to send in Tutor Marked Assignments, to track my progress.

    Just my penny-worth...
     
    Certifications: Foundations, Site Designer & JavaScript
    WIP: Server Admin, and Perl
  13. BosonMichael
    Highly Decorated Member Award

    BosonMichael Yottabyte Poster

    19,136
    462
    374
    I got my ASS at birth. It's gotten bigger over time, but it really hasn't helped me much in my career. Actually, now that I think about it, if I didn't have it, I probably wouldn't be able to sit in front of the computer and perform admin tasks or write, so maybe it HAS helped me in my career!!!

    :p
     
    Certifications: CISSP, MCSE+I, MCSE: Security, MCSE: Messaging, MCDST, MCDBA, MCTS, OCP, CCNP, CCDP, CCNA Security, CCNA Voice, CNE, SCSA, Security+, Linux+, Server+, Network+, A+
    WIP: Just about everything!
  14. Arroryn
    Honorary Member

    Arroryn we're all dooooooomed

    4,009
    186
    209
    I don't know what an ASS is in IT industry terms, but the fear of it getting too big may explain the disproportionate men:women ratio.

    I'm glad you're happy with yours, BM :rolleyes:
     
    Certifications: A+, N+, MCDST, 70-410, 70-411
    WIP: Modern Languages BA
  15. BosonMichael
    Highly Decorated Member Award

    BosonMichael Yottabyte Poster

    19,136
    462
    374
    Yeah, it's done pretty well for me. That said, my wife didn't marry me for my ASS, my co-workers aren't jealous of my ASS, and my employers never really looked at my ASS. I was even ready to show it during the interview, but they told me that it wasn't necessary.
     
    Certifications: CISSP, MCSE+I, MCSE: Security, MCSE: Messaging, MCDST, MCDBA, MCTS, OCP, CCNP, CCDP, CCNA Security, CCNA Voice, CNE, SCSA, Security+, Linux+, Server+, Network+, A+
    WIP: Just about everything!
  16. MrNerdy

    MrNerdy Megabyte Poster

    544
    4
    0
    Up to now I have preferred studying with others either during the day or at evening classes.
    A lot of Colleges in the UK now run CompTIA A+.
    Also some colleges also offer Cisco IT Essentials I & II.
    IT Essentials I will help you to take A+, IT Essentials II will help you take Server+. Then Cisco hope you will go onto take CCNA.

    The reason I have used this method is that a lot of these courses are heavily subsidised through the EU's program on IT & if your on a low income or UB40 you can get some free.
     
    Certifications: ECDL, CiscoIT1 & A+
    WIP: Girlfriend & Network+
  17. stuPeas

    stuPeas Megabyte Poster

    774
    12
    76
    As for the point that going with a training provider helps if you lack motivation.....This is RUBBISH. If you lack motivation then you will simply not read the providers material.

    As for the assignments giving "measured steps", you will find that any book geared toward certification will also have questions at the end of each topic.

    And, as for needing feedback from tutors, In my experience, most of the tutors dont know what the hell they are talking about. Forums, however, are cramed full of experienced, knowledgable people that make most tutors look like trained monkeys.

    One advantage, however, of spending loads of cash on a TP can be explained by the Psychological theory of Cognative Dissonance. In this context it would say that, because you spent a sh-t load of money, Then not doing the work will create a sense of psychological unrest (where would we be without Psychologists).

    To sum up.
    Research your chosen cert until you are blue (no offence Blue) in the face. Find the right materials (books, etc). Try to keep your goals in your mind (stay in a like minded community, ie CF).
     
    Certifications: C&G Electronic, CIW Associate (v5).
    WIP: CIW (Website Design Manager)
  18. wizard

    wizard Petabyte Poster

    5,763
    35
    174
    Anyone seen the TV advert for Advent training? They're doing the usual trick, saying you could get a 30k job at the end, sound familiar?
     
    Certifications: SIA DS Licence
    WIP: A+ 2009
  19. Sparky
    Highly Decorated Member Award

    Sparky Zettabyte Poster Moderator

    10,191
    299
    319
    No,but I saw the one for CT, same old wage BS :biggrin
     
    Certifications: MSc MCSE MCSA:M MCSA:S MCITP:EA MCTS(x5) Security+ Network+ A+
    WIP: Exchange 2007\2010
  20. stuPeas

    stuPeas Megabyte Poster

    774
    12
    76
    What?? you mean to tell me that you guys with certs are not on 30K??

    Arent there laws against this kind of advertising??
     
    Certifications: C&G Electronic, CIW Associate (v5).
    WIP: CIW (Website Design Manager)

Share This Page

Loading...