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Should I stay or go?

Discussion in 'Employment & Jobs' started by reverb, Apr 9, 2012.

  1. reverb

    reverb Byte Poster

    I'm sure most of you have gotten to the point that you hate going into work - I can say that's how I feel right now or for many months actually. I've been in my current job for over 18 months (technically my 1st IT role) and I'm what you can a one-man-IT-department :D. I do everything from desktop support to server administration to changing light bulbs and making tea.

    There's a load of things I'm actually miffed about work that has led me to think like this.
    I'm over worked, get pulled left right and centre where I cannot concentrate and focus one or two things. This leads me to work past my contracted hours sometimes. Sure people work 60hr+ but I only get paid graduate-ish wage. I sometimes do a little work here and there from home because as much as I do not want to do it as I'm at home, it will just only have a knock on effect to the next day which of course that will be me to pick up the pieces anyway. I always go the extra mile but do not get rewarded financially or even thanked.

    I have next to no money to spend for tools, upgrades or projects that I want to carry out; Things like toner it's "ok" but I still get asked questions and get looked like I've done something wrong because I spent some money :D. Software/addons expiring/expired etc...you get the idea. With no budget and the current IT set up in place, it will only stunt my growth and development and stall my career. I'm quite proactive so I get bored quite easily when I don't do/learn something new.

    Time off for holiday/sick day/day offs is fairly difficult as there is umm no one to cover. Likewise same with interviews. There alot more but I don't have time to write more or want to put that much in a public forum. Sorry I guess I'm just venting :p

    The upside is that I've learned quite alot in that short space of time :)

    Would you ever quit a job before having another job lined up first? I've started looking (but more actively in the coming weeks) but taking time off to go to interviews is hard for me so quitting outright has played on my mind...or would that be career suicide? :D
  2. SimonV

    SimonV Petabyte Poster Administrator

    I would leave or seriously change the way I worked, I wouldn't take on all the burden as it sounds like YOU cant change the situation at work, Id make efforts to speak to the management about the state of things and your thoughts on what need to change, record what you told them and when and try and push some of the burden back onto them.

    At the end of the day its only a job, BUT we depend on our jobs and in some situations others depend on us and our jobs so just leaving without another job to move on to wouldn't be the best choice.

    Think about the way you work, do you skip lunch, do you miss appointments or family events, is your personal life suffering? If so change the way you work as to some degree your to blame for the situation your in, I dont mean the work related stuff as in budgets etc I mean the balance you have currently.

    Try and slowly change the way your working, I say slowly because if you just decide that from tomorrow I'm working to rule your going to make more problems for yourself. Communicate your issues to your management and re-enforce them with evidence, if your working extra hours and getting everything done why would management think anything is wrong. To them your getting everything done and for the same amount of money, why bring in another person at extra cost while your doing it all for nothing and why give you extra budget when things are working just fine right now. Make them see the bigger/ longer picture.

    Dont create hostility between you and your management, work with them to solve your issues. If you try that and it doesn't work then yes start to look for another job but look at changing your own working habits first, you never know you might be your own worst enemy in some of this.
    Certifications: MOS Master 2003, CompTIA A+, MCSA:M, MCSE
    WIP: Keeping CF Alive...
  3. BC

    BC Bit Poster

    Working unpaid overtime is a big no-no.

    The company pays you for 40 hours a week. Any more than that should be at at least time and a half.

    Doing it without complaining will mean you have to keep doing it and nothing will change.

    By all means work hard but don't prop up a failing support system by working yourself silly. If this is a two person job then you need to highlight that to the management because they'll take advantage of your good nature forever if it saves them money.
    Certifications: MCP, MCSA:M, MCSE, MCTS
  4. ade1982

    ade1982 Megabyte Poster Forum Leader

    You're in exactly the same position I am there, bro. To the word.

    It depends what you have saved, and what you can live on whilst you search for a job as it's bleak out there (at least in my part of the country), and it might get to the point where you have to take a job similar to the one you are in out of necessity. I probably wouldn't do it, but then I don't take risks.
  5. BigG

    BigG Nibble Poster

    Hi reverb
    Having worked in a similar situation (not IT) - I can tell you that you are on a hiding to nothing if you continue in the same vain as you are. In fact you are actually making things worse for yourself :ohmy

    What I mean by this is that, whilst you flog your guts out, people are treating this as "the norm" and that is why you get no thanks. Why would anyone thank you for just "doing what you always do"?

    So make the change and stop being treated like a door mat. What you need to do now is become more assertive (i.e. in charge) but without being confrontational.
    Although I don't know your exact circumstances, here are a few tips to be a bit more business savvy:

    1. Learn to say "no" to new work (or being pulled from one job to another). Even if you will eventually do it, you can change peoples mindset by not being a "yes man".
    2. Sit down with your manager and agree your prioity work. Do not accept everything as "Priority 1"
    3. When new work comes along tell people that it is not a priority. Should it be a priority, ask your manager which of the other priorities will be dropped to accomodate it? What you are doing here is forcing your manager to "manage" plus you can deflect angry people to them instead of coping the flack.
    4. Learn to say "no" to important people. Nothing gets a problem identified and resolved quicker than explaining to a director that they can't have someting due to work loads / priorities / lack of cash. (appear willing to help but "your hands are tied.."
    5. Stop doing so much overtime (take a holiday). When the work piles up and people notice, especially important people, decisions happen.
    6. Have serious chat about your work / wage / lack of help. Sometimes managers really don't know there is a problem until you tell them - even if it's obvious.

    In short, you need to skillfully, manage the situation to the point where you are not killing yourself and it's obvious there is a problem that nees to be addressed. This will result in one of two things; change or you being threatened with the sack. If the company has any intelegence they will choose "change", as for the other option, who's loss is it?

    Finally, the Power Play*.
    if the above does not work for you, or you get to the point you want to quit. Try the "balls out" approach to negotiation! :)

    Hand in your notice and explain why you are leaving.
    This will either prompt immediate action from the company or you end up leaving (win win)

    If they ask you to stay then you make the demands (more money foremostly...). Plus they will suddenly realise how much they need you.
    If they call your bluff expecting you to retract your notice, you must never do this as they then know that "you don't have the balls.."

    A friend has used the "balls out" approach 3 times in a row with the same company. He has a very nice salary...

    Be strong out there


    * Rules for the Power Play
    1. You must be in a very strong position
    2. You must be serious and committed to leaving the business unless your demands are met
    3. Negotiation on your demands is ok, but do not negotiate yourself back to your original position
    4. You do not retract your resignation (assume you have already left and plan for the future)
    5. Use sparingly or your bluff will be called
    Certifications: BSc, Prince2 Practitioner, MCSA Win7, MCSA 2008
    WIP: Vmware, ITILv3 on the back burner
  6. reverb

    reverb Byte Poster

    Thanks for the posts guys.

    BigG, thanks for taking the time to write a long and informative reply. No I reassure you I don't yes to everything! :D You definitely made alot of good points though :)

    Management is also one of the many issues. I don't really get on with my up line, who is the MD.
    I will try the "balls out" approach in the future when I do decide to leave just to see how much (and if) they would increase my salary! It's not somewhere I will stay even if they doubled (wishing thinking) my salary however.

    I have left work on time this week, so that's a start :)
  7. newbridge

    newbridge New Member

    Don't intend to hack the thread. I am in a similar situation as well, but there is no issue with management or my boss. Its a small company and I am on a graduate pay since almost more than a year I joined and have learnt a lot during that time. I know there would be review soon or I can ask for one.

    There are quite a few jobs related to my skill-set in larger corporations with higher pay and benefits which I am quite attracted to. I am in dilemma whether to ask for a good pay hike or start looking for a company where my salary expectations are met. My friends say there is no chance a small company would give a pay rise of 7-10K (it might seem greedy of me, but thats the market rate), so instead of negotiating and then leaving Its better to resign amicably. Don't know why but I also get a guilt feeling of just leaving like that.

    Would really appreciate any suggestions or advise.
  8. BigG

    BigG Nibble Poster

    If your MD is the issue then you are really in a pickle! Either
    1. Leave
    2. Balls out approach - it's amazing how a bad job can become a good job (or at least tolerable) for the right salary (not the best choice I'd recommend but definatly worth concidering.
    3. Work on other directors of the business. Explain the situation to them to see if they can help. It may work or you may end up just annoying them - but Like Dr Pepper, whats the worst that can happen?
    4. Accept the status quo and try to find a way to work it to your advantage (prioritise things that help your learn new skills etc)

    If you can get another job with better pay and benefits, why aren't you applying? If the other company say yes they want you, you can either take the job or perform a "balls out" negotiation with your current employer! :)
    In your case, a lack of commercial experience (assuming you are a graduate) may mean that you don't get an interview and/or a job offer. But, if you think you can do what the other jobs are offering. Go for it. If you don't buy a ticket you wont win the lottery...

    One of the worst things I've learned about business, is that there is no loyalty towards staff anymore. So don't EVER feel bad about leaving or asking for more money if you truly believe that it is justified.

    Good luck Guys

    Certifications: BSc, Prince2 Practitioner, MCSA Win7, MCSA 2008
    WIP: Vmware, ITILv3 on the back burner
  9. newbridge

    newbridge New Member

    Thanks for the reply BigG. What do people do when they start applying for jobs when they are already in a job. And the prospective employer asks for reference.
    Is it common for any current employer to give reference for the next employer of his staff ? I was bit worried if they keep a bad taste in mind if I don't actually accept the new offer/not get selected and decide to stay with the same company.
    Am sure most of people go through this, but I am a bit hesitant.
  10. reverb

    reverb Byte Poster

    Yep, I've planned and started point 4 and implement new things to learn, improve my knowledge on and to put it on my CV that I've done/used it :biggrin

    You new employer will usually ask for references until after you have been given a conditional offer. I wouldn't worry about it to be honest so don't let that put you off applying. :)
    Even usually on applications form there is a box there to specify whether they can contact your referees before the interview or not.
    Last edited: Apr 16, 2012
  11. Naj

    Naj Bit Poster

    Similar issue to myself. I've worked for a very large BPO for 3 years. Request for pay rise has been rejected twice, not by manager but head office. The pay rise would still leave me short of what my longer serving, less capable colleagues earn. The manager admitted he should have offered me a lot more when he had control of wages! I've tried working less hard but its just not me and the work ethics I value. Seriously considering handing my notice in before I find a new job!
    Certifications: NA
  12. subliminalsmurf

    subliminalsmurf Nibble Poster

    Same here. I fell into the same kinda rut here.
    I look after so much stuff (servers, blackberry, desktop support, upgrades, roll outs, patching, images, deployment, Vmware...the list goes on) for a FIRST LINE wage. There are in excess of 10 "first line" staff and yet none of them have half the responsibility I do.

    I love what I do but, like you, I get no extra pay or even promoted above first line but what you need to think about is the exposure you can get and the training you're getting that will lead you on to bigger and better things.

    I'm getting certified AND getting real world training to apply this stuff to. Ok, I could use more money (couldn't we all) and I hate coming to work sometimes because I feel like I should be in a better position and earning more than the people who are "the same level" but do far less (they're log and flog pretty much).

    The pros, for now, are on par with the cons. You just need to figure out if it's worth sticking it out or if you can find somewhere else to grow. I'm looking, I'm always looking.

    My advice would be to do the same. Look but never quit your job first. It's not worth it. The dole queue is the scariest thing I can think of. ;)
    Certifications: MCITP: Windows 7 Desktop Support Technician
    WIP: 70-686 - Started the same day as passing 680

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