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Open Source: Software no one will buy

Discussion in 'The Lounge - Off Topic' started by ffreeloader, May 30, 2008.

  1. ffreeloader

    ffreeloader Terabyte Poster

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    That's been said on these forums more than once.

    Well, it's funny how MS doesn't see OS that way. Following are to links to interviews and statements from MS employees on how MS views open source.

    First, MS sees open source as a bigger competitor that Google and more distruptive to their business goals. Most likely the majority of us are all familiar with Ballmer's famous/infamouns chair-throwing rant about Google so what must he say about open source? :biggrin

    Second, MS says they are learning from open source and beginning to model their OSs after open source development principles. Server 2008 is modeled on open source ideas of design and implementation. Think of that. Software so bad nobody will buy it is copied by MS. LOL.... Seems a few MS fanboys don't quite "get" open source, or their personal dislike for me is so strong they say things they don't even believe.

    I've been telling you guys again and again that you need to start getting ready for the future, and the future is open source. Many of you just blow me off as not having a clue as to what I'm talking about. You think the future is going to be all MS just like the past has been, but that's not the future according to how even MS sees things. You better get started learning to administer Linux if you want to be ahead of the curve.

    Most of you remember d-Faktor and how skilled he was. That's what he was doing. He was learning Linux because he saw it coming. He knew it was a force to be reckoned with in the not too far distant future, and he wanted to be ready when the future becomes now.

    http://ostatic.com/163434-blog/interviews-four-open-source-questions-for-microsoft

    http://blogs.zdnet.com/microsoft/?p=1418
     
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  2. zimbo
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    zimbo Petabyte Poster

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    You may actually have hit the nail on the head. Its a belief I heard from two proffessors here in uni - one is a CCIE actually so he has not just a Phd he did work in industry. I was talking about how graduates will enter the market and its tough making it. We all got a degree but we like sheep and following the pack - the MS way. When the talk changed to skills and qualifications they asked me if i knew much about certs and i told them i got two - MCSA and MCDST and that im working on Cisco. The one just said - "following the sheep" you learning skills that so many people are getting - you just putting yourself against them in the job market" make yourself unique and do something people cant see now - Open Source Server Admin - Red Hat and Ubuntu/Debian it got me thinking!!! 8)
     
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  3. ffreeloader

    ffreeloader Terabyte Poster

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    That prof is correct. Be ahead of the curve, not behind it, and you'll find yourself being a valuable commodity....
     
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  4. greenbrucelee
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    greenbrucelee Zettabyte Poster

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    Open source is good and it will probably be the future, hell even supermarkets are selling PCs with Linux instead of an MS OS but all being said I have no issues with using or paying for MS OSs it does what I want it to and everything I have is compatible with it.
     
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  5. zimbo
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    zimbo Petabyte Poster

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    Its the whole big debate! LOL Windows XP does that you want it to do.. so does Server 2003 and 2008.. but on the other hand so doest Debain and Red Hat doesnt it? I still see Linux in the server room thou... cutting costs down - saving your company and clients money.. and making you more valueable cause you have the skills to manage linux servers - like freddy said. 8)
     
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  6. greenbrucelee
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    greenbrucelee Zettabyte Poster

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    I agree, I havent had any exposure to the server side of it yet, but hopefully I will soon :D
     
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  7. Crito

    Crito Banned

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    Sometimes I feel like I'm living in a negative universe. IBM and UNIX used to be the dictators controlling our computer lives. Microsoft and Windows were the rebels here to liberate us. Today those roles have been completely reveresed. Microsoft is exerting dictatorial control and Linux will save us.

    Makes me wonder what the scene will be like in 20 more years... I can almost imagine the headlines: "Microsoft emerges from chapter 11" and "Windows v23 threatens Linux's 90% market share". :ohmy
     
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  8. ffreeloader

    ffreeloader Terabyte Poster

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    But the point is, if you replace your proprietary software with open source it doesn't cost you anything to do it, or to upgrade it in the future. It will continue to cost you to use proprietary software.

    However, to a companies that isn't even the biggest advantage of open source. Say your company, like my boss, is using a piece of software that is critical to how the company functions, and the proprietary software company goes out of business, changes the features in their software, or a bug exists that is a major problem for the company but not for the software company and they don't want to fix it. What does your company do then? Where and how will the company fix software problems that arise in the future? How will they add any necessary functions to that product if they need to when updating how they themselves do business? They can't. They are held hostage by the company they bought their software from.

    With open source they have the source code to the software. They can hire a developer if they need to add functions, fix bugs, etc... even if the open source project goes away or changes the current product into something that doesn't work with how the company's business is built. They control their own destiny, their own future.

    That is the greatest advantage of open source software in the business world, and more and more companies are becoming aware of this fact. That's why open source is growing by leaps and bounds. People are sick and tired of being held hostage by proprietary software companies.
     
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  9. greenbrucelee
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    greenbrucelee Zettabyte Poster

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    Noted cheers for the info :thumbleft
     
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  10. zimbo
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    zimbo Petabyte Poster

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    Eh come on Crito.. two greek brains.. im sure we could come up with GreekOS... then we can retire on some island and play golf all day.. greeks... golf.. no that dont sound too right does it? :rolleyes:
     
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  11. neutralhills

    neutralhills Kilobyte Poster

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    I'd kill to be able to run Photoshop CS3 on my Linux boxen. If I had that, I'd never need to run Windows again. Not for personal use, anyhow.
     
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  12. ffreeloader

    ffreeloader Terabyte Poster

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    Well, go out and kill something then. Google paid for the Wine foundation to be able to afford to make Photoshop run well under Wine.

    I figured a "pro" like yourself would have already known this.... :twisted::biggrin

    http://arstechnica.com/news.ars/pos...cates-linux-users-with-wine-improvements.html
     
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  13. BosonMichael
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    BosonMichael Yottabyte Poster

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    Will it have a backdoor? :twisted:

    Sorry, couldn't resist. :p
     
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  14. fortch

    fortch Kilobyte Poster

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    That was somewhat accusatory and flammable. Why do you insist in vitriol? If anything, it hurts that OS flag that you wave -- you should really contribute positively rather than negatively. For example, for every slanderous thread against the Evil Empire, substitute a way for OS to equal or exceed a task that MS would perform. You've done it a few times, and I personally value that, but the majority of your persuasion is negative. Do your cause a favor, and us too.

    BTW, you do realize that there are hard-working, hugely contributing people at Microsoft too? People that contribute to making IT better? Amazingly enough, some even suggest alternate solutions to their own employer? Of course they're listening to OS, why wouldn't they? Talent and great ideas are everywhere, and MS had eyes and ears all over. Ever read any of their blogs? This Godzilla you've created in referencing Microsoft as an entity is poor taste, and unfair as well. Tagging the evolution of Server 2008 to the footsteps of OS is a bit misleading as well. Sure, it was an influence, but crediting too much is purely speculation without fact. Tossing in comments about Balmer doesn't help, since he hasn't proven to be a stellar manager.

    I've worked with both technologies, and there are pros and cons with each. I'm no MS fanboy, and I certainly don't dislike you (rather, quite the contrary), but I feel your diatribe is somewhat disingenuous. Help me to leverage OS, rather than hammer on what I have to deal with everyday. *Give* me more reasons to move the draconian licensing out of my shop.
     
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  15. neutralhills

    neutralhills Kilobyte Poster

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    CS2 has decent compatibility. CS3, what I've upgraded to, is still flakey as hell, and the colour management support still blows fat hairy chunks. And because it's not a native application, rendering large files is painfully slow. Vista is faster at this, which ain't sayin' much. I'm hoping that it'll be stable with good colour management by this time next year.

    As things stand right now, CS3 support on *nix is more of a curiosity and simply can't be considered for a production environment. Do send me a note when CS3 runs as well under *nix as it does under XP, will you?

    I'd like to see Adobe release a native version of PS for *nix. This app alone would drive a tonne of traffic over to the other platform.

    Even better, I'd love for GIMP to catch up to and pass Photoshop. But that will be some years off, and is unlikely given Adobe's patent portfolio. :(

    Haven't claimed to be a pro with Linux -- merely proficient in certain areas. With image editing tools, I function at the pro level. I find it's best not to comment on topics where my knowledge is limited.
     
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  16. Mathematix

    Mathematix Megabyte Poster

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    One of the big problems that I've noticed with Open Source is standardisation. I so wish that I could make the switch to Ubuntu, but:

    1. It doesn't support my sound card.
    2. Many official hardware manufacturers refuse to as least support Linux to some level.
    3. The overall UI is more challenging to use than Windows, making this a potential issue for widespread use.
    4. Tools for the lone developer to make multimedia apps (yes, like games! :biggrin) are very seriously lacking.

    These are just a few of the points that come to mind that reduce its suitability to my requirements. Ubuntu is excellent, but points 1, 2 and 4 prevents me from making a complete switch. :(
     
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  17. fortch

    fortch Kilobyte Poster

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    That's always been the contention, at least with every person I've known -- they'd have to give up something to make a complete switch. I would love to toss MS out the door, but they already have well documented implementations in place for the stuff my company needs done *yesterday*. Often times, I don't have the time (due to people higher on the food chain) to fully research alternative ways, and even then its generally shunned, because the higher-ups are all wrapped up in catch-phrases and branding that MS loves to roll out. Sure, I could tell them that OS is cheaper, more standardized, and generally more functional than a Microsoft-branded product, but sometimes that ain't enough. Finally, say what you will about MS, but there is a *huge* support base for any of their products. Ever been to office.microsoft.com? Does openoffice.org have a site like that? Umm...nope.

    To Freddy's point, we live in a Microsoft/Apple world, and that's what developers code for, unless they don't mind living in the woods and making ice cream for a day job. Other than that, Open Source relies on the free time (or non-booked job time) of a majority of its contributors. Or, if said employer were to utilize OS stuff, then development would advance much quicker, which I believe would be a great idea. That's what Open Source advocates are pushing, and I would love to see this come to fruition. Another problem, though, is the difficulty blending the proprietary and OS stuff. It can be done, but it takes time, patience and trial-and-error, which some of us don't always have.

    I want more options in my job. If I can have Sharepoint functionality w/o MS, complete with all functionality and support, then I'd jump in a heartbeat. If I can use FreeRadius in my SecureID implementation rather than IAS, great. If I can toss AD out and use OS, so much the better. However...all these things have been done, yet I can't snap it into place without spending time that I don't have. OS is great for TCOO? It sure should be, but time is money too...and I can run with the three things in a Microsoft world much quicker than in an OS world, as of right now. I, for one, would love to see this change -- and I do believe it's changing -- but I can't always be a part of this change. That's the Catch-22 here; in order for this evolution to progress, it takes contribution from more of us everyday. I'm already putting in 12 hour workdays -- I'd rather not be Neo. MS allows me to go home and spend time with my wife, play guitar, and go to the beach.
     
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  18. Modey

    Modey Terabyte Poster

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    I have to say that I wholeheartedly agree with what Fortch has posted thus far.

    I have tried some of the different distro's of Linux before and am considering setting one up on my home system so I can get the maximum out of my memory and hardware when it comes to virtualisation as I don't particularly like Vista Ultimate x64.

    After reading threads like this though and so much negativitey I start to think is this what it's like to embrace open source? Some of the stuff you come out with Freddy is like listening to a politician slag off an opponent or some type of systematic negative PR campaign. I think you would get your points across much better (and your obvious passion) if you simply tried to emphasis the good points of Open Source without having to resort to constantly having a go at MS or other companies.
     
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