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Non Certificaiton Training

Discussion in 'Polling Station' started by Phoenix, Nov 28, 2007.

?

Would you pay for Non certification related training?

  1. Yes, definatly, i've always wanted that!, no matter the cost

    5 vote(s)
    12.2%
  2. I'd be interested, as long as its cheaper than certification training

    17 vote(s)
    41.5%
  3. I'm interested, but I dont really care

    7 vote(s)
    17.1%
  4. No, thats the lamest idea ever, stick to fixing printers Ryan

    12 vote(s)
    29.3%
  1. Phoenix
    Honorary Member

    Phoenix 53656e696f7220 4d6f64

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    So my question is
    Would you pay for quality training if it was non certification based?
    ie, not directly attached to a specific course, but perhaps would benefit anyone persuing a multitude of courses

    I ask because there tend to be two types of provider I have come across in my time

    Non Vendor training, they use thier own custom material, are often cheaper than the others, but quality varies and at the end of the day there is no guarantee anything is tied in to an actual exam

    Vendor training, not provided BY the vendor, but these are courses like the MS courses that go along side an exam (if you check the exam website it lists the appropriate courses)

    If someone offered a quality course, that was hands on, not purely theory, and was not related to a cert at all (lets say, Windows 2003 Domain Operation for example) whilst being beneficial to an exam, was not tied to it, not restricted to content thats relevant to the exam, not rushed, and very detailed

    Would you pay for it? would you have the willpower to take that advanced knowledge and turn it into a Pass? or are you really interested in certs certs certs?

    I ask rather selfishly as its something I have considered doing, and wondered if its a worthwhile endeavor, I work on the cutting edge of technology and I hate going on courses that have one aim and dont to into real life requirements/hurdles etc, If I ever teach people I want them to learn a trade, not learn to pass a test!

    Anyway vote above, and give your thoughts
     
    Certifications: MCSE, MCITP, VCP
    WIP: > 0
  2. simongrahamuk
    Honorary Member

    simongrahamuk Hmmmmmmm?

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    I'd definately take it.

    Certification is no longer of much interest to me. I like to learn to help me do my job and understand things better.

    When you are studing for a cert you cover things that you will never encounter again in your entire career, and whilst it helps to have an understanding of those things you do not necessarilly need the depth that the certs training will go into. A course that covers more day to day things would appeal to me far more.

    8)
     
  3. greenbrucelee
    Highly Decorated Member Award

    greenbrucelee Zettabyte Poster

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    I am not sure what to vote :blink

    If it enhanced my knowledge and could advance my career yep, but as long as it wasnt a rip off.
     
    Certifications: A+, N+, MCDST, Security+, 70-270
    WIP: 70-620 or 70-680?
  4. Phoenix
    Honorary Member

    Phoenix 53656e696f7220 4d6f64

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    The consideration of what a rip off is is debatable, plenty of people lap up the 4k courses that offer very little real value, but are 8 weeks long, people FEEL they are getting more bang for their buck
    a MS sanctioned training course is often 5 days and costs over 1500 quid
    thats the standard cost, and I could never justify charging MORE than that, at the end of the day with training, its very much the quality of the instructor that defines your experience, and good instructors cost lots of money, as if they were not training, they would be earning lots of money somewhere else

    a VMWare fast track course for example is 5 days, and costs 5400 USD (about £2.7k!!)
     
    Certifications: MCSE, MCITP, VCP
    WIP: > 0
  5. wagnerk
    Highly Decorated Member Award

    wagnerk aka kitkatninja Moderator

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    My answer is "Yes". I would (and have gotten my company to pay for) training courses that weren't/aren't certification based.

    However it would have to meet at least 1 criteria:

    1. If it was competing against a certificated course it has to be cheaper.
    2. If it would benefit me.
    3. If I had a interest in it.

    Those are the top 3 I can think of.

    -ken
     
    Certifications: CITP, PGCert, BSc, HNC, LCGI, PTLLS, MCT, MCITP, MCTS, MCSE, MCSA:M, MCSA, MCDST, MCP, MTA, MCAS, MOS (Master), A+, N+, S+, ACA, VCA, etc... & 2nd Degree Black Belt
    WIP: PGDip
  6. Rob1234

    Rob1234 Megabyte Poster

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    Lets see if I got this right are you saying you would offer training on certifications similiar to CompTIA and MS or would they be your own training courses that you have made yourfelf.
     
    Certifications: A few.
  7. Phoenix
    Honorary Member

    Phoenix 53656e696f7220 4d6f64

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    No
    The course would be Technology based, not certification based
    if you wanted to learn Virtualization, I would teach Virtualization, not the VCP course
    if you wanted to Learn AD, I would teach AD, not 70-294 AD Management course

    The courses would be structured to include hands on, and theory, and be real world relevant, not tied to strict exam objectives

    this would be career training, learning to be better at what you do, not learning to pass a test 50% of which is not useful in the real world
     
    Certifications: MCSE, MCITP, VCP
    WIP: > 0
  8. Rob1234

    Rob1234 Megabyte Poster

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    I see. So it would be good from a learning point of view but if you were looking for it to help you in your career the actual knowledge you have would help you but if you went for jobs would people who have the actual certs in that area may have a better chance of getting the job. I guess it's good if you want to learn the stuff and are not to concerned about certs.
     
    Certifications: A few.
  9. nXPLOSi

    nXPLOSi Terabyte Poster

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    Personally at this early stage in my career, I wouldn't, mainly because its not an easy career to take on, and I don't think I could afford to go for non certification based training because I couldn't prove to potential future employers that I know my stuff.

    Although I would definitely go for it in the future, once im established in the field and have a strong background.
     
    Certifications: A+, Network+, Security+, MCSA 2003 (270, 290, 291), MCTS (640, 642), MCSA 2008
    WIP: MCSA 2012
  10. derkit

    derkit Gigabyte Poster

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    I think it has its place but does depend on the individuals' circumstances - I vote, "Yes I'd be interested, as long as its cheaper than certification training"

    It's a sound idea, but it would have to be substantially cheaper - say £100-£150 per day for a course (roughly!) compared to Microsoft £300 per day
     
    Certifications: MBCS, BSc(Hons), Cert(Maths), A+, Net+, MCDST, ITIL-F v3, MCSA
    WIP: 70-293
  11. BosonMichael
    Highly Decorated Member Award

    BosonMichael Yottabyte Poster

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    I don't pay for certification-related training, so why would I pay for non-certification-related training? Especially since there's so much stuff out there on the Internet! :)

    That said, I wish the option had just said, "No", and not, "No, ya loser!" :blink
     
    Certifications: CISSP, MCSE+I, MCSE: Security, MCSE: Messaging, MCDST, MCDBA, MCTS, OCP, CCNP, CCDP, CCNA Security, CCNA Voice, CNE, SCSA, Security+, Linux+, Server+, Network+, A+
    WIP: Just about everything!
  12. Phoenix
    Honorary Member

    Phoenix 53656e696f7220 4d6f64

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    its all tongue in cheek Mike, you can call me a Loser I wont clock you or anything :P

    I'm surprised at the expectations of people, theres a big demand for training, a lot of which is sub par, but people would expect something that didnt come with a certification at the end to be substantially cheaper than something that did, despite it probably being a more advanced and structured course

    definitely food for thought, thanks for the input guys
     
    Certifications: MCSE, MCITP, VCP
    WIP: > 0
  13. BrotherBill

    BrotherBill Byte Poster

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    I have to say that I would, and have in the past. Sorry Ryan, I couldn't find a good fit in your option for voting.

    If this is something that you're good at and may follow up on, another outlet to consider are university or college sponsored online education. The courses are reasonable enough to attract a large customer base and the classes can be administered from anywhere. Most have recruitment links available on their websites.

    Good Luck,
    Bill
     
  14. derkit

    derkit Gigabyte Poster

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    I based my opinion on my current thinking - that is, taking what all these "training" companies offer - if you, just assuming it was you, sent me a syllabus for a course that was exactly up my street, at the right time in my career and blew my socks off at covering a whole world of stuff - then yes I would pay top price for it.

    I suppose, this discussion has to be taken in the abstract until there is an actual course to be able to judge the worth of it.
     
    Certifications: MBCS, BSc(Hons), Cert(Maths), A+, Net+, MCDST, ITIL-F v3, MCSA
    WIP: 70-293
  15. ffreeloader

    ffreeloader Terabyte Poster

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    You left out an option: Depends.

    Whether or not I would pay for training would depend upon perceived value. What would I perceive as high value?

    • Appropriate subject matter to what I'm doing.
    • How quickly I needed to get up to speed on a subject.
    • How easy it was to verify the worth of the course for my needs.
    • How highly those skills are valued in the job market place.

    The last qualifier for me would probably be just how quickly my investment would pay for itself and begin to show a profit.
     
    Certifications: MCSE, MCDBA, CCNA, A+
    WIP: LPIC 1
  16. ThomasMc

    ThomasMc Gigabyte Poster

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    i would be very interested in this sort of training, have you thought about delivery of your program, will it be 1:1, classroom or internet based?
     
    Certifications: MCDST|FtOCC
    WIP: MCSA(70-270|70-290|70-291)
  17. Finkenstein

    Finkenstein Kilobyte Poster

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    I've been to non-certification oriented technical training. I actually enjoy it because it allows you to really get comfortable with a product and not worry about "is that on the test?". Generally, in my experience, I get more technical use out of that kind of training. It's just nice to get to learn a product and not just learn what's important for the test.
     
    Certifications: MCP, Network+, CCENT, ITIL v3
    WIP: 640-822
  18. simongrahamuk
    Honorary Member

    simongrahamuk Hmmmmmmm?

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    I think that Ryan was most likely simply posing a hypothetical question regarding the type of training people are looking for, rather than setting up an actual course.

    I could be wrong though. 8)
     
  19. ThomasMc

    ThomasMc Gigabyte Poster

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    ah gotcha, I thought he was maybe testing the market :)
     
    Certifications: MCDST|FtOCC
    WIP: MCSA(70-270|70-290|70-291)
  20. JohnBradbury

    JohnBradbury Kilobyte Poster

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    I would. In fact my favourite CBT provider [trainsignal] aims more at this market.
     

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