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MICROSOFT STUDENT CAMPUS a.k.a JAMES THORNTON

Discussion in 'New Members Introduction' started by sarah_roberts, Aug 13, 2006.

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  1. sarah_roberts

    sarah_roberts New Member

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    Has anyone had an interview with Microsoft Student Campus? I was approached by them and I was interested because I thought they were actually part of Microsoft (In their advert they have "Secure your future with Microsoft...".

    My concern is that they are letting people believe they are Microsoft.

    Have a look at :

    http://www.microsoftcampus.com/HOME.ASP

    it clearly states they are the Microsoft Student Campus. I'm sorry but if someone said they were the Microsoft Student Campus I would assume they were part of Microsoft

    I am now aware it is not Microsoft but I wonder how many people must of joined the company thinking it was Microsoft.

    Has anyone had any experience of the Microsoft Student Campus a.k.a James Thornton

    Could anyone share their experiences of this company and did you believe they were Microsoft
     
  2. The_Geek

    The_Geek Megabyte Poster

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    Well, I looked at the website. The first thing that I saw was the "M$ gold certified partner" logo at the top, which tells me they are a parnter with M$ and not actually part of them.
     
    Certifications: CompTIA and Micro$oft
    WIP: PDI+
  3. zimbo
    Honorary Member

    zimbo Petabyte Poster

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    i havent had any experience with them but to me they sound a little *too real* to be true.. if i got all the info correctly they going to put you through the whole MCSE in 15 days?? :eek: MCDBA in 10? Thats not POSSIBLE at all!
     
    Certifications: B.Sc, MCDST & MCSA
    WIP: M.Sc - Computer Forensics
  4. r.h.lee

    r.h.lee Gigabyte Poster

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    Disclaimer: I'm on the west side of the pond.

    Sarah_roberts,

    In this day and age of phishing it is good that you had the gut instinct to have the "possibly too good to be true" feeling.

    Here's what I've found out...

    Microsoft has a Partner Program. Details are at https://partner.microsoft.com/ . The Microsoft Partner program has three levels: 1) Registered Members 2) Certified Partners 3) Gold Certified Partners. The graphic located at the top left corner of http://www.microsoftcampus.com/ indicates that they are claiming to be a "Microsoft Gold Certified Partner."

    For a Microsoft Gold Certified Partner, there are 13 Competencies that they may achieve, to include "Learning Solutions." These types of Microsoft Gold Certified Partners are those who provide non-academic Microsoft Training. In other words, they're usually rather expensive.

    If they're claiming to be a "Microsoft Gold Certified Partner," then we shouldn't have a problem looking them up in the Microsoft Resource Directory located at http://directory.microsoft.com/mprd/ . After selecting my language as "English (United States)", selecting my country as "United Kingdom", and clicking on "Training", I began my search.

    At the "Microsoft Resource Directory" page, I clicked the [+] next to "Narrow your search by Geography" text. I clicked the (*) State/Province radio button. I chose the state of "England". I chose the city of "London". I chose the proximity of "20 miles." Then I clicked [Find Partners].

    The only listing in the Microsoft Resource Directory that even comes close is "James Thornton Limited" as the Microsoft Gold Certified Partner. Here's the Microsoft "Partner Profile" for "James Thornton Limited" at http://directory.microsoft.com/mprd...anguageDropDown=173&SearchGroup=TrainingRadio . According to the Partner Profile page, the official web address listed is "http://www.jamesthorntongroup.com."

    When I go to http://www.jamesthortongroup.com, I am forwarded to http://www.mscorporatecampus.com.

    According to Whois, here is some info about jamesthorntongroup.com:
    Registrant:
    James Thornton Ltd
    77 Oxford Street
    .
    .
    London, . W1D 2ES
    UK
    Updated Date: 19-Apr-2006
    Creation Date: 17-Apr-2005
    Expiration Date: 17-Apr-2007

    According to Whois, here is some info about mscorporatecampus.com:
    Registrant:
    James Thornton Group
    77 Oxford Street
    London, UK w1d2es
    GB
    Updated Date: 20-Feb-2006
    Creation Date: 20-Feb-2006
    Expiration Date: 20-Feb-2007

    According to WHOIS, here's some information about microsoftcampus.com is as follows:
    Registrant:
    James Thornton Group
    77 Oxford Street
    London, UK W12D2ES
    US
    Updated Date: 20-Feb-2006
    Creation Date: 20-Feb-2006
    Expiration Date: 20-Feb-2007

    Now, here's the curious thing. When I go directly to http://www.microsoftcampus.com/HOME.asp , I see their "Earn as you Learn (L22k - L25k p/a)" program. However, when I go to http://www.microsoftcampus.com, I'm forwarded to http://www.msstudentcampus.com . The key thing that is missing from http://www.msstudentcampus.com is the "Earn as you Learn (L22k - L25k p/a)" program offer. Sounds phishy to me.

    I also think that it's rather phishy that there are like four domain names involved with this outfit: 1) microsoftcampus.com 2) jamesthorntongroup.com 3) msstudentcampus.com and 4) mscorporatecampus.com .

    Also, if you're new to Microsoft Training and Certification, learning from a "Microsoft Gold Certified Partner - Learning Solutions" organization may not be the best way to learn the material. Microsoft Gold Certified Partner - Learning Solutions was formerly known as "Certified Technical Education Centers" or CTEC for short. They are usually high cost, low time, high rate, cram courses for those employees of Certified Partners who needs to maintain their "Certified Partner" status by maintaining their "Certified Professionals" on staff requirement. Microsoft Gold Certified Partners are for-profit organizations. The Microsoft IT Academy program is usually associated with non-profit educational institutions such as colleges and universities. Guess where Gold Partners earn their profits? You got it, their students.

    I hope that I've given you enough information.
     
    Certifications: MCSE, MCP+I, MCP, CCNA, A+
    WIP: CCDA
  5. zebulebu

    zebulebu Terabyte Poster

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    Superb detective work!

    I agree wholeheartedly with everything in r.h.lee's post.

    Intensive courses are just as worthless as braindumping your way through a cert. You'll learn nothing except how to pass the exam, have no clue about using the technology in the real world and will get instantly weeded out in any selection process for interview.

    Stick with a school that won't make unrealistic promises, doesn't 'guarantee' you'll pass the exam and doesn't put a stupid timescale on passing. Anyone who has ever taken an M$ exam will tell you that you need at least six months' hands-on experience (either 'on the job' or via a decent home lab) to have a good chance of passing an exam without cheating. To pass the MCSE I would think you'd need at least two years' of same.

    Don't get disheartened by the above - so long as you are willing to invest the time and effort you will pass, but it is a long, hard road to doing so and you need a lot of spare time or, if you;re already in the industry, an understanding employer to do so.

    Good luck!
     
    Certifications: A few
    WIP: None - f*** 'em
  6. The_Geek

    The_Geek Megabyte Poster

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    Hmmm....gonna take this one step further:

    jamesthorntongroup.com. A IN 3600 64.79.167.77
    OrgName: Savvis
    OrgID: SAVVI-2
    Address: 3300 Regency Parkway
    City: Cary
    StateProv: NC
    PostalCode: 27511
    Country: US


    mscorporatecampus.com. A IN 3600 64.209.142.6
    OrgName: Savvis
    OrgID: SAVVI-2
    Address: 3300 Regency Parkway
    City: Cary
    StateProv: NC
    PostalCode: 27511
    Country: US

    Something just smells funny here. Both sites are registered out of London, but both IP addresses are out of Cary, NC USA (about an hour from where I live).
     
    Certifications: CompTIA and Micro$oft
    WIP: PDI+
  7. Rik

    Rik Nibble Poster

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    Sherlock Homes has nothing on you guys! :biggrin

    God help anyone on Ebay that trys to rip you guys off :D

    Welcome Sarah btw :)
     
  8. UCHEEKYMONKEY
    Honorary Member

    UCHEEKYMONKEY R.I.P - gone but never forgotten. Gold Member

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    If it's too good to be true then it probably is (quote from Gav)

    It always amazes me the amount of companies out there setting up a once in a life time deal in computer training.:rolleyes:

    Does anyone know if there is a list like the 'Which group' that shows all these companies and rates them?? :blink
     
    Certifications: Comptia A+
    WIP: Comptia N+
  9. JonnyMX

    JonnyMX Petabyte Poster

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    They seem to have a really odd certification track.
    MCAD seems to be 305 (web applications with VB.NET) and 315 (the same exam with C#) then 320 (XML with C#) and 229 (SQL).

    Why do two versions of the same exam?
     
    Certifications: MCT, MCTS, i-Net+, CIW CI, Prince2, MSP, MCSD
  10. Sandy

    Sandy Ex-Member

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    Never heard of them!
     
  11. zebulebu

    zebulebu Terabyte Poster

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    I'd imagine because they think that once you've passed the first one, the second one will have the same exam content but presented in a different language?

    Either that or they are the only braindumps their instructors could snarf from <some Braindump site> for nothing... :D
     
    Certifications: A few
    WIP: None - f*** 'em
  12. wizard

    wizard Petabyte Poster

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    Hi there and welcome to CF :)
     
    Certifications: SIA DS Licence
    WIP: A+ 2009
  13. AndrewDavis

    AndrewDavis New Member

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    they came to my house and i had to literally push them out in the end and ended up choosing www.learnitonline.co.uk they weren't pushy with me which made me feel much more comfortable.

    truth is James Thornton deliberately masquerade as Microsoft like many other dodgy tactics used by trainign companies this is sumthing I'd like to see regulated by a government agency to ensure us students don't get ripped off for thousands!
     
  14. NickyYates

    NickyYates Bit Poster

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    For 10 months James Thornton (a.k.a Microsoft Campus, a.k.a Microsoft Student Campus) have advertised that they will pay students to train with them (£1000 a month) and will guarantee jobs with an 'Official Microsoft Partner' with a minimum salary of £22,000. These are just some of the less grandiose claims they have made. For example, they had a website - www.microsoftwomen.com - where these philanthropists offered to take women out to Dubai to train for the guaranteed job. They would be given a £500 allowance, and experience "pampering at its most exquisite" (the home page showed a building the shape of an Arab dhow - it's the Burgh in Dubai - the world's only seven star hotel where the £500 allowance wouldn't even pay for breakfast). In fact, these were a bit too far off the wall even for Microsoft - and the site now redirects to Microsoft's main site.

    There's nothing illegal about such claims - they just have to be true. In line with this, companies may also be required to substantiate such claims if asked by the ASA. That is what happened to James Thornton on August 23rd...

    http://www.asa.org.uk/asa/adjudications/non_broadcast/Adjudication+Details.htm?Adjudication_id=41660

    The ASA adjudication is about as unambiguous as it gets - they are liars. Sorry - I'll rephrase that... the company was in breach of CAP code 7.1. (this code concerns "Truthfullness"). The particular advertisement complained about named roughly 20 leading companies they claimed their students worked for. Not one had ever employed any student trained by James Thornton. The complaint didn't mention the more ludicrous aspects of the company's claims - so the ASA raised these itself. I have never seen this before. The issues the ASA raised included...

    - Paying students to train with them - complete and utter rubbish!
    - Guaranteed Minimum Salary - complete and utter rubbish!
    - No Job No Fee - complete and utter rubbish - they are paid in advance

    James Thornton had the perfect opportunity to get the best advertising money could buy - except it would be free and THEY BLEW IT!!!

    The website www.gumtree.com were intimidated into removing references to the fact that James Thornton could not provide a single shred of evidence to substantiate the claims that they have now made for over ten months. What is the point in such a website? If the junkyard-dog-type lawyers get in touch threatening injunctions and expensive legal action, ask them (in line with the pre-action protocols) to either substantiate the questions posed by the ASA or to piss off. Any injunctions would be overturned in the public interest.

    Trust me on this one - these clowns will never stand in front of a court - more's the pity.
     
  15. zebulebu

    zebulebu Terabyte Poster

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    Nicky

    I've just gone back and read all the posts you've made on this forum.

    I must say, you come across as a very lucid, competent individual.

    Believe me - I've read MORE than a few rants from people pissed off at rip-off tech training providers in the past - you certainly strike me as someone who has been in this position yourself, but, unlike the majority of them, your posts are very well-thought out, extremely well-crafted and manage to pull off the neat trick of pulling no punches whilst still providing informative advice.

    OK - I'll get my tongue out of your arse now!

    It seems to me that there are a LOT of people in the UK who have bought into the rip-off merchants' BS, and I'm wondering whether you have ever considered settinmg up some sort of website sepficially warning people of the dangers of shelling out a whole heap of money for a CDL without taking the proper time out necessary to think things through.

    This forum is a fantastic resource for people considering such a move - I've only been here a couple of months after migrating most of my forum posting activity from a couple of forums that were great, but largely US-centric - but there is only so much it can do. If there was a web resource available for people to go to which didn't necessarily (for obvious legal reasons) name any individual companies, but warned people against the dangers of buying into the bullshit, I'm sure it would prove invaluable for those poor souls just starting out on the cert merry-go-round!

    I don't have the time needed to set such a site up, but I would certainly contribute to one if it was available.

    Just a thought!
     
    Certifications: A few
    WIP: None - f*** 'em
  16. levana

    levana New Member

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    Hi Guys,

    Just thought I'd thank you all for sharing this info. I just got a call this afternoon from a representative of James Thornton student corporate campus, as they called themselves, and ended up setting an appointment with them.

    But after hanging up the phone, I thought the entire thing sounded a bit dodgy so I 1471 to get a number, which of course was withheld. So I turned to the net and found your fascinating thread on what sounds like everybody’s favourite Microsoft training providing.

    I have now cancelled my appointment, so thanks for the heads up and all the info guys put together and bless you for saving at least one gullible fool from making a big mistake.
     
  17. Jakamoko
    Honorary Member

    Jakamoko On the move again ...

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    Unfortunately on the grounds of legality ,CertForums are now locking this thread pending Staff investigation.
     
    Certifications: MCP, A+, Network+
    WIP: Clarity

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