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MCSA or Server +

Discussion in 'General Microsoft Certifications' started by noel123ie, Aug 26, 2008.

  1. noel123ie

    noel123ie Nibble Poster

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    Hi there



    I was wondering am I better just doing the mcsa or a mix.



    Maybe do a+ and net+ which will count as an mcp.



    I could do net+ and ser+ in local college and then the a+ in my own time.



    I would then have one mcp(a+ and net+) and server+



    Or I was wondering am I better just doing a+/net+( 1 mcp) and then keeping on mcsa route



    This is whats covered in server+



    Operating System Fundamentals
    Windows 2000 and Network Operating Systems
    Windows 2003
    VMWare
    Network Components and Security
    TCP/IP Networking
    Linux Installation and Administration
    System Administration
    TroubleShooting


    Some exposure to linux etc



    Thanks

    Noel
     
    Certifications: MCSA Sec+
  2. BosonMichael
    Highly Decorated Member Award

    BosonMichael Yottabyte Poster

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    That depends on your experience level. If you have 6 months of real-world experience administering servers, then the MCSA is a great choice. If not, you should consider the A+, Network+, and MCDST certifications.

    The A+ and Network+ can be used as an elective for the MCSA, but they will NOT grant you the MCP certification. The only thing that will grant you the MCP certification is taking any one of the older Microsoft exams (one from the Windows XP or Server 2003 track, not an MCTS or MCITP exam).

    You can save money and do ALL of them through self-study... at your own pace, on your own schedule.

    I would recommend doing the Server+ after you have some real-world experience with server administration. If you've got that, then great!

    I would recommend starting with A+, Network+, and MCDST. When you have about 6 months of server admin experience, I'd recommend pursuing Server+ and the MCSA. Certifications without the appropriate amount of experience are not going to be very useful to you.
     
    Certifications: CISSP, MCSE+I, MCSE: Security, MCSE: Messaging, MCDST, MCDBA, MCTS, OCP, CCNP, CCDP, CCNA Security, CCNA Voice, CNE, SCSA, Security+, Linux+, Server+, Network+, A+
    WIP: Just about everything!
  3. Qs

    Qs Semi-Honorary Member Gold Member

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    MCSA is quite a high level Microsoft Certification so I suggest you start smaller and go for either CompTIA's A+, N+ or a MCDST if you're just starting out.

    Link can be found below:-

    CompTIA's A+

    CompTIA's N+
    MCDST

    Also bear in mind that if you're aiming to burst into the IT field with no prior experience then potential employers won't look twice at you. You need both experience and qualifications. If you're going for a 1st line support role then the aforementioned links and referenced certs are the way to go.

    No, it doesn't. I refer you to this thread.


    That's a possibility. Pretty much all of the CompTIA certs can be done self-study though if you don't wish to pursue them through a college. I'd recommend going for the A+ and the N+ to start though as this will build up a knowledge base for higher level qualifications and will also bolster your CV without becoming over-certified.


    No, you wouldn't. See the aforementioned link.


    It's entirely up to you, we can only offer advice. (Plus.. It won't count as an MCP) The A+ and N+ is generally what the recommendation is for people wishing to obtain a 1st line support/helpdesk role though. Such roles also build up your experience for higher level jobs (2nd line etc)


    Well if that appeals to you then go for it. Any experience with servers is useful and I for one wouldn't discourage going for additional qualifications if they're beneficial to you. My recommendation though is to get some experience (volunteer for IT related roles - helping out at your local college etc) and put it on your CV, and concentrate on smaller fish (A+, N+ etc) before going after the whales (MCSA).

    Don't ya just love metaphors?

    Hope this helps. :)

    Qs
     
    Certifications: MCT, MCSE: Private Cloud, MCSA (2008), MCITP: EA, MCITP: SA, MCSE: 2003, MCSA: 2003, MCITP: EDA7, MCITP: EDST7, MCITP: EST Vista, MCTS: Exh 2010, MCTS:ServerVirt, MCTS: SCCM07 & SCCM2012, MCTS: SCOM07, MCTS: Win7Conf, MCTS: VistaConf, MCDST, MCP, MBCS, HND: Applied IT, ITIL v3: Foundation, CCA
  4. Qs

    Qs Semi-Honorary Member Gold Member

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    Michael! Curse you and your better than average typing speed! :p I now have to scroll down a lot more to read my reply :p

    Qs
     
    Certifications: MCT, MCSE: Private Cloud, MCSA (2008), MCITP: EA, MCITP: SA, MCSE: 2003, MCSA: 2003, MCITP: EDA7, MCITP: EDST7, MCITP: EST Vista, MCTS: Exh 2010, MCTS:ServerVirt, MCTS: SCCM07 & SCCM2012, MCTS: SCOM07, MCTS: Win7Conf, MCTS: VistaConf, MCDST, MCP, MBCS, HND: Applied IT, ITIL v3: Foundation, CCA
  5. BosonMichael
    Highly Decorated Member Award

    BosonMichael Yottabyte Poster

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    You can't always be first, my friend. ;) Not with Mr. Speedy Fingers over here across the pond. :p

    Would it help if I repped your post? :twisted: Sorry, couldn't resist! :biggrin heehee!!!
     
    Certifications: CISSP, MCSE+I, MCSE: Security, MCSE: Messaging, MCDST, MCDBA, MCTS, OCP, CCNP, CCDP, CCNA Security, CCNA Voice, CNE, SCSA, Security+, Linux+, Server+, Network+, A+
    WIP: Just about everything!
  6. Qs

    Qs Semi-Honorary Member Gold Member

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    *sulks*

    ... I found it quite scary how similar our replies were as a matter of fact. I swear it's the wireless that slowed down my posting speed *grr*
     
    Certifications: MCT, MCSE: Private Cloud, MCSA (2008), MCITP: EA, MCITP: SA, MCSE: 2003, MCSA: 2003, MCITP: EDA7, MCITP: EDST7, MCITP: EST Vista, MCTS: Exh 2010, MCTS:ServerVirt, MCTS: SCCM07 & SCCM2012, MCTS: SCOM07, MCTS: Win7Conf, MCTS: VistaConf, MCDST, MCP, MBCS, HND: Applied IT, ITIL v3: Foundation, CCA
  7. noel123ie

    noel123ie Nibble Poster

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    Hi

    I already work in an IT company(call centre) and have a diploma in IT support so have a good basic knowledge of networks

    Would the mcsa not look better on a cv?

    Thanks
    Noel
     
    Certifications: MCSA Sec+
  8. wagnerk
    Highly Decorated Member Award

    wagnerk aka kitkatninja Moderator

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    The MCSA is geared towards people that meet the below:

    And not just 6 months on helpdesk. Professional certifications aren't to be used as a short-cut or a replacement for experience at that level. Unfortunately because lots of people are gaining these certifications that are there to validate your experience, alot of managers (including myself) are now over-looking these certs if your work experience doesn't back them up.

    Sorry to be harsh, but in the classes that I've taught in the last academic year, I've had MCSA's & MCSE's that had these creds but were absolutely clueless when it came to do the simple things like joining a PC to a domain.

    -Ken
     
    Certifications: CITP, PGCert, BSc, HNC, LCGI, PTLLS, MCT, MCITP, MCTS, MCSE, MCSA:M, MCSA, MCDST, MCP, MTA, MCAS, MOS (Master), A+, N+, S+, ACA, VCA, etc... & 2nd Degree Black Belt
    WIP: PGDip
  9. BosonMichael
    Highly Decorated Member Award

    BosonMichael Yottabyte Poster

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    Not if you don't have experience, no. In fact, being overcertified for your experience level can actually hurt, not help, your chances of getting a job. Employers with MCSA-level jobs won't hire you because you have the experience, and employers with entry-level jobs may not hire you because they really don't need someone with MCSA-level qualifications to do an entry-level job. Thus, you can put yourself into an unemployable situation (unless you leave the MCSA off your resume - and if that's the case, why pursue it at this stage of your career?).
     
    Certifications: CISSP, MCSE+I, MCSE: Security, MCSE: Messaging, MCDST, MCDBA, MCTS, OCP, CCNP, CCDP, CCNA Security, CCNA Voice, CNE, SCSA, Security+, Linux+, Server+, Network+, A+
    WIP: Just about everything!
  10. noel123ie

    noel123ie Nibble Poster

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    Hi there

    I also went to local college and saw a presentation on CCNA

    I was very impressed with the lecturer and also I would have covered some of this on my diploma course

    I also see CCNA on alot of job ads

    Any help would be great
    Noel
     
    Certifications: MCSA Sec+
  11. BosonMichael
    Highly Decorated Member Award

    BosonMichael Yottabyte Poster

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    In my opinion, the CCNA is even MORE advanced than the MCSA - it's designed for people who are starting to get some real-world network administration experience with Cisco devices. It will not be of much use to you at the beginning of your IT career.

    Sounds like you're trying to find a "shortcut" or "fast track" in IT. The problem with that is... unless you've got an uncle who is an IT manager, there really *isn't* a shortcut. You start out with an entry-level IT job, and you work your way up. And to get an entry-level job, you need entry-level certifications, such as the A+, Network+, and MCDST. If you want to get a job as an IT tech, there aren't any other certifications that will help you out other than those three when you're just starting out.

    Best of luck to you!
     
    Certifications: CISSP, MCSE+I, MCSE: Security, MCSE: Messaging, MCDST, MCDBA, MCTS, OCP, CCNP, CCDP, CCNA Security, CCNA Voice, CNE, SCSA, Security+, Linux+, Server+, Network+, A+
    WIP: Just about everything!
  12. noel123ie

    noel123ie Nibble Poster

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    Hi there

    Thanks for all the info guys

    Spoke to guy in college who give CCNA- this is a government college so this guy makes nothing from this

    He also had 62 people for 38 places so no reason for him to push me towards course.

    I asked him whether i would have knowledge required to complete course and he said yes as part of diploma.

    So i decided to go with this- in the meantime I have 1 year to get a job on helpdesk etc so I will not be someone ccna certified with no practical experience.

    Thanks
    Noel
     
    Certifications: MCSA Sec+
  13. BosonMichael
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    BosonMichael Yottabyte Poster

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    If you're getting a job on helpdesk, then even after a year, you won't likely have any practical experience with Cisco. Administering Cisco routers is a network admin responsibility... about three steps past helpdesk. (help desk > desktop support > server admin > network admin)
     
    Certifications: CISSP, MCSE+I, MCSE: Security, MCSE: Messaging, MCDST, MCDBA, MCTS, OCP, CCNP, CCDP, CCNA Security, CCNA Voice, CNE, SCSA, Security+, Linux+, Server+, Network+, A+
    WIP: Just about everything!
  14. fatp

    fatp Byte Poster

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    I never did the 'helpdesk'; I got a 'desktop support' job for my first and current job.

    So the way I see it:

    (1) 1st line support - (call centre environment) / Desktop Support (onsite) - around the same level of expertise who escalate to...
    (2) 2nd Line Support / Network Technician - more knowledgale folks who escalate to...
    (3) 3rd Line Support / Server admin / Network admin - all round technical jedi master.

    but obviously depends on the firm, the responsibilities of the job, people within i.t dept etc.

    Also one man's second line is anothers 3rd etc.

    and yes the cisco stuff is for (3) of my list.
     
    Certifications: Comp Sci BSc, NVQ 2 & 3 IT Professional
    WIP: Comptia A+, Network+
  15. BosonMichael
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    BosonMichael Yottabyte Poster

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    Yes, you can get a desktop support job as your first job. Some employers want experienced desktop support techs; others will hire people without experience for those jobs. So you are correct... what some companies deem as 1st line/2nd line/3rd line can differ. That said, there are just some jobs that are always gonna be 3rd line jobs, as you also correctly stated.
     
    Certifications: CISSP, MCSE+I, MCSE: Security, MCSE: Messaging, MCDST, MCDBA, MCTS, OCP, CCNP, CCDP, CCNA Security, CCNA Voice, CNE, SCSA, Security+, Linux+, Server+, Network+, A+
    WIP: Just about everything!
  16. noel123ie

    noel123ie Nibble Poster

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    Hi there

    Im now reconsidering due to advise I recieved on here

    Thanks folks great guidance on here

    What would you think of this

    MCITP: Enterprise Administrator


    Cheers
    Noel
     
    Certifications: MCSA Sec+
  17. BosonMichael
    Highly Decorated Member Award

    BosonMichael Yottabyte Poster

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    Sorry, but it sounds like you're dead-set on going after an advanced certification before you have the recommended amount of experience.

    The MCITP: EA is roughly equivalent to the MCSE on 2003. As such, Microsoft recommends the following experience level before pursuing it:

    If you're interested in finding out what certification vendors suggest regarding experience levels, check their Web sites... it's all listed right there for you.
     
    Certifications: CISSP, MCSE+I, MCSE: Security, MCSE: Messaging, MCDST, MCDBA, MCTS, OCP, CCNP, CCDP, CCNA Security, CCNA Voice, CNE, SCSA, Security+, Linux+, Server+, Network+, A+
    WIP: Just about everything!
  18. noel123ie

    noel123ie Nibble Poster

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    Hi there

    I would like to get where Im going as fast as possible..yes maybe too fast

    I have the option of doing server +, net + and a+

    However Ive a diploma and have done id say 1/3 of ccna on this course

    I think though if I do a+/net+ ill be duplicating what I already have.

    I could do net+ and ser+ this will count as one mcp correct?

    Thanks a mill for help
    Noel
     
    Certifications: MCSA Sec+
  19. noel123ie

    noel123ie Nibble Poster

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    Hi there

    I was looking into doing MCDST

    If I get this however I will have no path towards the MCSA etc.

    I would have to start all over?

    Would I be better going the mcsa route..maybe starting with a simple one and working on, meanwhile I can add this to cv when I send these out

    Thanks
    Noel
     
    Certifications: MCSA Sec+
  20. nugget
    Honorary Member

    nugget Junior toady

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    Well as I see it you seem to be ignoring all the good advice given time and time again. This advice is rock solid and proven many times over as the best way to get into IT.

    By all means, if you want to get there fast then go do the CCNA and the MCITP: Enterprise Administrator certs. You will only find then that you are paper certified, you can't get a job because you don't even have any helpdesk/1st level support experience and that your time and effort to gain these certs was wasted.

    You say that if you do the A+ and Network+ you'll be duplicating what you already have. If you do these then you will fill in a lot of gaps and that is guaranteed.

    If you follow the advice given you will really achieve what you want faster than if you go straight for the big certs first.

    You can't build the top of a pyramid without building a good solid foundation to put it on.
     
    Certifications: A+ | Network+ | Security+ | MCP (270,271,272,290,620) | MCDST | MCTS:Vista
    WIP: MCSA, 70-622,680,685

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