Is age a factor?

Discussion in 'Employment & Jobs' started by adrian, Nov 3, 2009.

  1. MLP

    MLP Kilobyte Poster

    305
    19
    59
    Not at all. I hope no offence was taken - there was none intended.

    In general though, the average 18 year old, as mentioned by the OP, may lack a little maturity at times. Not all younger IT pro's, but when I was 18, I was way too much of a prat to be working in any responsible job. Socialising and drinking were much more important to me. Not saying that they aren't important now, just not at the expense of my work.

    I have met some 18 year olds that demonstrate a level of maturity that is required to work in such a job - more so than a few 40 year olds I know, but I've also met (and worked with) a lot more that don't.

    The point I was trying to make was that if I was recruiting, if there were two applicants that were otherwise equal, I would consider someone 21+, because by that time, most would have had a little more life experience, either working elsewhere or studying.
     
    Certifications: HND Computing
  2. BosonMichael
    Honorary Member Highly Decorated Member Award 500 Likes Award

    BosonMichael Yottabyte Poster

    19,183
    500
    414
    I direct your attention to the words "more likely".
     
    Certifications: CISSP, MCSE+I, MCSE: Security, MCSE: Messaging, MCDST, MCDBA, MCTS, OCP, CCNP, CCDP, CCNA Security, CCNA Voice, CNE, SCSA, Security+, Linux+, Server+, Network+, A+
    WIP: Just about everything!
  3. danielno8

    danielno8 Gigabyte Poster

    1,306
    49
    92
    Nah no offence taken. I understand what you mean with regard 21+ having more life experience etc, and that's why you would choose them over an equal candidate aged 18. But not your thoughts about a youngster lacking the maturity required. Most 18 year olds in IT aren't going to be in a particular position of importance anyway, and those who were would likely have shown the required maturity/attitude to get themselves into a position of importance.
     
    Certifications: CCENT, CCNA
    WIP: CCNP
  4. BosonMichael
    Honorary Member Highly Decorated Member Award 500 Likes Award

    BosonMichael Yottabyte Poster

    19,183
    500
    414
    Any position is important. Otherwise, the position wouldn't exist. If I hire someone for a help desk position, I *rely* on that person to cover that phone, regardless of how unimportant you might feel that job is. A lack of maturity could manifest as missing shifts, extended breaks, "playing" while at work (such as reading when they ought to be on a call), being rude to callers, or diverting calls to others while they kick back and do nothing. Those who did that tended to be younger. Obviously, not all were, and some older people did those things as well... but maturity tends to come with age.
     
    Certifications: CISSP, MCSE+I, MCSE: Security, MCSE: Messaging, MCDST, MCDBA, MCTS, OCP, CCNP, CCDP, CCNA Security, CCNA Voice, CNE, SCSA, Security+, Linux+, Server+, Network+, A+
    WIP: Just about everything!
  5. danielno8

    danielno8 Gigabyte Poster

    1,306
    49
    92
    I am not saying it is unimportant in the sense you are making out, but them getting their job right is certainly not as critical as the guy whose job it is to ensure *insert critical production service* keeps running.

    But that isn't really what i was saying. I think someone who is in the early twenties should be treated as mature enough to do a job as much as he who is 25+ until they show differently.
     
    Certifications: CCENT, CCNA
    WIP: CCNP
  6. MLP

    MLP Kilobyte Poster

    305
    19
    59
    In an ideal world, this would be the case. However, most of my experience has been working on small teams, where the 1st/2nd/3rd line support structure can be blurred, and a new starter may have domain admin access. This is something we are working to address where I am at the moment, with delegated rights etc, so that the entry level staff have no need to access servers, log on as domain admin etc.


    How do you know my Technician?:D
     
    Certifications: HND Computing
  7. Sparky
    Highly Decorated Member Award 500 Likes Award

    Sparky Zettabyte Poster Moderator

    10,718
    543
    364
    Not sure about that mate. Customers in many cases only talk to the helpdesk while the infrastructure guys fix the issue, if the helpdesk sucks then it doesn’t matter if the infrastructure issue is fixed quickly as the customer will always refer to “that rude guy on the helpdesk”.
     
    Certifications: MSc MCSE MCSA:M MCSA:S MCITP:EA MCTS(x5) MS-900 AZ-900 Security+ Network+ A+
    WIP: Microsoft Certs
  8. BosonMichael
    Honorary Member Highly Decorated Member Award 500 Likes Award

    BosonMichael Yottabyte Poster

    19,183
    500
    414
    But maturity is important in ANY position I hire someone for. So your argument that maturity isn't as important in "less critical jobs" is flawed.

    Why should I automatically assume that someone is mature just because they're 20? or 22? or 24? or 26, for that matter?

    It's all about risk. Someone who is 20 is likely to be more mature than someone who is 18. Someone who is 25 is likely to be more mature than someone who is 20. And someone who is 30 is likely to be more mature than someone who is 22, or 25, or 27. Doesn't mean that they are. It just means that it is MORE likely that they are.

    Best thing a young person can do to combat that is to interview well.
     
    Last edited: Nov 4, 2009
    Certifications: CISSP, MCSE+I, MCSE: Security, MCSE: Messaging, MCDST, MCDBA, MCTS, OCP, CCNP, CCDP, CCNA Security, CCNA Voice, CNE, SCSA, Security+, Linux+, Server+, Network+, A+
    WIP: Just about everything!
  9. BosonMichael
    Honorary Member Highly Decorated Member Award 500 Likes Award

    BosonMichael Yottabyte Poster

    19,183
    500
    414
    Ah, when you've seen certain behaviors before, they're easier to spot in the future, aren't they? :biggrin
     
    Certifications: CISSP, MCSE+I, MCSE: Security, MCSE: Messaging, MCDST, MCDBA, MCTS, OCP, CCNP, CCDP, CCNA Security, CCNA Voice, CNE, SCSA, Security+, Linux+, Server+, Network+, A+
    WIP: Just about everything!
  10. danielno8

    danielno8 Gigabyte Poster

    1,306
    49
    92
    All i questioned was saying "someone who is x years is likely to be not mature enough to look after an essential business resource"

    Let me just put it this way - i'd say far more people under 25 (and the only reason i'm singling them out is becuase that is the age group which were originally singled out) are going to be mature enough to hold down a job than not.
     
    Certifications: CCENT, CCNA
    WIP: CCNP
  11. Mr.Kamwah

    Mr.Kamwah Bit Poster

    19
    0
    7
    Not in my experience of any kids my own age that i've ever met in the three secondary schools ive been in during my regular education and the two colleges i've been to after that. I only know a few people who've had a steady job longer than a month and thats only because its either that or be made homeless. A higher majority than should be are on JSA as soon as they become old enough which does sicken me.

    Maturity has nothing to do with age, it's not even you're upbringing. It's just another personal trait that you can have normally or it can be forced on you.

    But anyhow, to the OPs question. I believe theres ups and downs of what age you are when you apply for a job and those depend on what kind of job you're applying for and what the employer is obviously looking for.
     
    WIP: A+
  12. BosonMichael
    Honorary Member Highly Decorated Member Award 500 Likes Award

    BosonMichael Yottabyte Poster

    19,183
    500
    414
    That's not what was said. Maria said, and I quote (with bolding added for emphasis),

    That is altogether different from "likely to be not mature". Let me explain with another illustration. You are more likely to be hit by a car than to be struck by lightning. That doesn't mean that you're likely gonna get hit by a car. That simply means that there's a greater chance that you'll be hit by a car than by lightning.

    So... a youngster is NOT "likely to be not mature"... a youngster is "MORE likely to lack the maturity" than someone older. Totally different meanings. If you can't understand the difference, sorry, mate, I don't think I can explain it any better... I'd be more likely to be able to explain it to a brick wall (though I'm not likely to be able to do that). :p

    Hopefully, you get it now. ;)

    Didn't say they weren't. Then again... I didn't say they were, either. I don't know too awfully many responsible 25-year-olds... they've still got "playtime" in their system. Indeed, when I was 25, I was probably more responsible than most... but even I was much less responsible back then than I am now.
     
    Last edited: Nov 5, 2009
    Certifications: CISSP, MCSE+I, MCSE: Security, MCSE: Messaging, MCDST, MCDBA, MCTS, OCP, CCNP, CCDP, CCNA Security, CCNA Voice, CNE, SCSA, Security+, Linux+, Server+, Network+, A+
    WIP: Just about everything!
  13. Phoenix
    Honorary Member

    Phoenix 53656e696f7220 4d6f64

    5,749
    200
    246
    Hmm, not gonna get into the semantics of this thread,

    simply put

    yes, it matters
    not all the time, not everywhere, not as much as the other things, but it matters.
    I've seen it first hand, I sat out of work for almost 18 months at one point in my career living on savings because nobody wanted to put a 19 year old in charge of a team of 25 - 35 year olds, problem was, i'd been in IT for 5 years by then, more than most of the 'teams'

    ultmatly team dynamic is an essential consideration for the hiring manager, great skills dont always make up for messing with a good team, i've seen people let go because they just didn't fit in, I've left places because i didn't fit in, i think that aspect is more important than age, but age can play a part in not fitting into a team dynamic
     
    Certifications: MCSE, MCITP, VCP
    WIP: > 0
  14. danielno8

    danielno8 Gigabyte Poster

    1,306
    49
    92
    Very good explanaion boson, but totally wasted. All i did was miss the "more". My mistake.

    Anyway, If you want to judge someone on their age fine. I think it's wrong end of.
     
    Certifications: CCENT, CCNA
    WIP: CCNP
  15. soundian

    soundian Gigabyte Poster

    1,460
    71
    107
    Taking the hypothetical 22 yo and 18 yo, I would be more likely to give the job to the 22 yo.
    If everything else seems equal (IT experience, IT qualifications, motivation, sincerity, maturity etc) then the 22 yo is going to have 4 more years of a work history that I can check and verify. If that all checks out then I would feel the 22 yo would be less of a risk. Nothing to do with age directly but a 4 year difference in work experience at that age is quite a lot.
     
    Certifications: A+, N+,MCDST,MCTS(680), MCP(270, 271, 272), ITILv3F, CCENT
    WIP: Knuckling down at my new job
  16. dazza786

    dazza786 Megabyte Poster

    758
    30
    67
    Wow, much need?

    on topic: i would have said i was more immature around 18 than i am now (22), but it wasnt a silly/stupid immaturity, just i generally knew less and wasn't really bothered about repercusions when doing things
     
    Last edited: Nov 5, 2009
    Certifications: MCP (271, 272, 270, 290, 291, 621, 681, 685), MCDST, MCTS, MCITP, MCSA, Security+, CCA(XA6.5)
  17. Mr.Kamwah

    Mr.Kamwah Bit Poster

    19
    0
    7
    Lets just all agree to agree that you will always be judged on everything even if theres a law to protect you against it. Its inevitable, its how humans work lol.
     
    WIP: A+
  18. BosonMichael
    Honorary Member Highly Decorated Member Award 500 Likes Award

    BosonMichael Yottabyte Poster

    19,183
    500
    414
    Obviously there was, as there was misunderstanding going on.
     
    Certifications: CISSP, MCSE+I, MCSE: Security, MCSE: Messaging, MCDST, MCDBA, MCTS, OCP, CCNP, CCDP, CCNA Security, CCNA Voice, CNE, SCSA, Security+, Linux+, Server+, Network+, A+
    WIP: Just about everything!
  19. BosonMichael
    Honorary Member Highly Decorated Member Award 500 Likes Award

    BosonMichael Yottabyte Poster

    19,183
    500
    414
    I don't - not based on age alone. A good interview is much more important than merely knowing an age.
     
    Certifications: CISSP, MCSE+I, MCSE: Security, MCSE: Messaging, MCDST, MCDBA, MCTS, OCP, CCNP, CCDP, CCNA Security, CCNA Voice, CNE, SCSA, Security+, Linux+, Server+, Network+, A+
    WIP: Just about everything!
  20. danielno8

    danielno8 Gigabyte Poster

    1,306
    49
    92
    So two candidates, both interviewed well, equally qualified, and you go "oh hold on, he's 22, this other guy is 29," so one of the things you think is, "hold on, this 22 y/o MIGHT be immature, he's out"

    If that is the case, you might aswell ignore all his qualifications/experience, becuase he MIGHT have just blagged it all.
     
    Certifications: CCENT, CCNA
    WIP: CCNP

Share This Page

Loading...
  1. This site uses cookies to help personalise content, tailor your experience and to keep you logged in if you register.
    By continuing to use this site, you are consenting to our use of cookies.