Fraser McKenzie

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Did I read that correctly or have I missed something. Are you saying that you have a contract that states they will, in effect, refund you the money for your entire course if you pass the exams in a year?

Instead of "money back if not entirely satisfied", that would be: "money back if entirely satisfied" - which would be patently ludicrous. Are you sure you've read that contract correctly, or have I just got hold of the wrong of the stick...

 

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Yes, I think that is what they're saying, but despite the number of people in the same position, nobody seems entirely convinced and nobody has been able to quote what it actually SAYS in their agreement.

So the chances are there is one MAJOR catch somewhere, but nobody has worked out what it is.

 

Unless FM has some kind of motivation for getting people through the training quickly.
Meat for some kind of grinder possibly?

 

Basically, when I signed up, I had to take a 12 months interest free option to pay for the training. What my contract says (I understand people have been given different terms in their contracts depending on when they were signed up) is that I have to complete 9 exams within 1 year. If all 9 exams are completed within 1 year, they will find me a job paying at least 17k. I then have to work for that company for a minimum of 6 months. At this point, they will cover the cost of the training. If they cant find me a job within 3 months of me finishing my training, they will cover the cost of the training. They were also supposed to pay for all first exam attempts.

When I signed up, I was told I wouldnt have to pay for any of my training if I completed it within 12 months, which I have. But as it has now been 12 months since I took out the interest free option, the first monthly payment is due. What FM told me a few weeks ago was that they will cover the monthly payments payments until I have worked 6 months (or until 3 months have passed and they havent found me a job), at which point they will pay the remaining costs of the training. The first payment date has come and gone and I am no longer able to get in touch with anyone at FM.

Sorry if thats confusing...tried to be as clear as possible. Im a bit wary of publicly listing the terms of my contract online so hope that explains it a bit better.

 

Not confusing at all - that's nice and clear and explains it well, cheers. If that is indeed the case - and you have a contract which states it to be a fact - then you should be able to take said contract to the local citizen's advice bureau. They will pass you on to someone who can tell you whether or not you are liable in any way and, if not (and its FM who are liable) then they will have to pay off the finance company.

I suspect, however, that its not as simple as that - if it were, then FM would have gone bust months ago due to the downturn in available jobs in every industry - not just IT. There's probably a clause somewhere in the contract that states they aren't liable if they find you a job three hundred miles away from your house and you (naturally) can't take it, or that you work a period unpaid as an 'internship' before they have to find you paid work or something similar.

The last thing you should do is wait and see. Debts have a nasty habit of piling up - the sooner you get a resolution to it, the better.

 

Thanks for taking the time to reply. I will contact Citizens Advice Bureau and see what they have to say. I shall keep this forum posted.

 

You may also want to look at the terms of the finance. You said you took a 12 month interest free loan out?

Many TP's do not warn you that once the 12 months interest free period is up, you will be hit with 25% APR rate and nearly pay back treble what the course was.

Make sure you repay this loan with another one with lower interest.

When I used to work for Computeach, they were buggers for not telling students this was the case.

I have no experience with FM, but have had lots of experience with other TP's. I am afraid to say it looks like yo have been conned somewhere down the line.

Sorry

 

I agree with Zeb.
If you've got a contract, take it to CAB or a lawyer.

I suspect that there is either some kind of get-out clause in which case this will bring it to light, or they are simply not honoring the contract and hope that the majority of people won't do anything about it.

It is an impossible contract - in essence, if you complete the training within the given period and they find you a job, they pay for your training. If they can't find you a job, they pay for your training.

Their most obvious get-out clause is to prevent people from completing the training within 12 months by being obstructive. That should be a piece of cake, but given that there are several people here who seem to have completed it, something is going wrong somewhere.

 

Generally many TP's do a pretty good job of obstruction, they have a set schedule, you can't take certain modules before set dates.

This generally involves a fair amount of padding stuff out, arguably for weaker students, but what if you are a strong student ?

Now you have a distance learning provider making you study at the speed of the slowest member !

You can only book free exams at their test centres, which only open one day a week, etc, etc.

Sometimes you can't even book real cert exams until you pass in house tests at very high pass levels.

What good is a college that is incentivised to fail its students ?

Most students appear to end up learning nothing and using braindumps in an effort to get their money back, further damaging the students education and the certification industry.

If you get through all that you will still have a large debt to pay off, and will have to find your own job most likely.

 

True indeed, but then it's not a college, it's a business.
So the rule there would be 'make money, then keep it'.

In a blue sky world it would be nice to see them doing the decent thing and providing quality training that a student would be happy to pay for and refunding the fees if the student failed or was dissatisfied.

But that doesn't work so well as a sales tactic, as it implies that there is a chance of failure.
Why say 'pass the course or your money back' when 'pass the course AND your money back' hits so many more buttons?

 

The interest for this wasnt too bad but I think I'm going to get my dad to cover it for the time being. Never know when/if I'm going to get any money from FM.

The only obstruction I noticed were them failing to give exam vouchers in sufficient time.

Totally agree. I have to admit, I had to use braindumps in order to get the certifications just so I didnt have to pay. Its not possible to get MCSE certified learning at home with no hands on experience. I dont put any of the qualifications that I've received on my CV cos there's no point. I will just end up looking like a plonker in an interview.

 

Oh dear....

I think BM may have melted.

The only positive that could possibly be taken from this is the fact you've realised hands-on experience is vital to development as an IT professional.

As it is you now have a massive loan you shouldn't really have got in the first place and a risk of being decertified for life should you be picked up for your use of Braindumps.

 

Hi.

This is for anybody who has blindly signed up to this company. Please come to 'support for Fraser Mckenzie students' Facebook group. We need people who wish to take action against this company to sign up and get involved with our movement.

We are aiming to bring people together across the country to openly demonstrate and report this company, for what they are doing, on a large scale.

link:

http://www.facebook.com/topic.php?topic=10118&post=46539&uid=39067313552#/group.php?gid=39067313552

Mark

 

Please has anyone got/saved a copy of the job ad that Fraser McKenzie used to place on gumtree? Or the ad reference number or the email address that was used in the ad? It will be greatly appreciated if I can have any of those.
Thanks

 

This is exciting!

It's like being Robin Hood.

 

hello!
i too, like many people on here, seem to have been scammed by fraser mckensie.

first of all, is everyone CERTAIN its a scam? because i dont want to start complaining til i know for definate.

i signed up in october 2008 and was made to sign on the day. the interviewers could hardly speak english and i couldnt understand them. the 'interview' was absolutely NOTHING like a proper job interview, and was much more relaxed. i was stupid enough to sign because i was unemployed for a long time , and when this come along and i thought wow this is too good to be true, which obviously, it is.

i know only have 2ish months left and have hardly done ANY of the training due to being unsure whether this was all legit. so i am now facing having to pay back £8000 or whatever it is, if i havent finished by october
12th.

i dont like I.T and never have and yet i was stupid enough to sign the contract.

i am unemployed, and was unemployed at the time of the interview but was never asked if i was. how is an unemployed person meant to pay back all this money?!?!?!

i am definately considering going to citizens advice, as i have absolutely no way of paying this back.

any help or advice would be very much appreciated.

thanks,
kirsty x

 

...So let me get this straight...

• You had no interest in IT.
• You knew it was too good to be true.
• You knew you couldn't pay it back due to being unemployed.
• You couldn't even understand what the salesman was saying.

...and you still signed?!

Uh. Yeah. I think I'm just going to post Zeb's original response and then GTFO.

Qs



Hope this helps:-

 

Ur, I was sort of wondering about that part of it.
Sorry, Kirsty I really don't want to be negative and I would like to say that I'm sorry for the situation that you find yourself in.

But...it's...very...hard...

 

Hi ..i need help..

I signed with frazer mckenzi last october..n thought its gud oppurtunity to join IT...signed the contract as i was confident that i'll pass my examz easily within a year n i'll get d job.But now i passed all my examz n tryin to call them from last week but they are moved from office, tried every contact detail but not gettin any response..Don't know what to do now as i am worried that bank is gonna start takin d money out from my accout from october n i can't really arrord to pay monthly installments...Thinkin to cancel d direct debit but i m scared that its gonna affect my credit history..Don't know what to do...can anyone plz help me if thay know sumthin more about what to do...