fraser mckenzie repayments

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Ummm.... What?

Again, please, in something even remotely approaching English

 

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A limited company means exactly that, limited liability. In law the company is a seperate legal entity. Once the company is bankrupt and wound up / closed, thats it.

There is no one to go after, you cannot go after the people who ran the company for your money, unless you can prove fraud or some other criminal activity.

As part of the bankruptcy process the auditor/reciever is responsible for trying to liquidate any assets and give any money back to creditors.

You can get yourself placed on the list of creditors.

Unfortunately secured loans, banks, business agreements etc, are likely to be higher in the queue than you, realistically your money is gone.

Not only that but it looks like a scam from the outset, so I expect the people running the company left no net assets and only debts.

Thats my understanding, but as with all legal matters, speak to a lawyer !


At first glance it looks like the company is still trading :-

If its not gone into liquidation try the small claims court and CIB.

Sounds like they were still trading as of last month. http://www.forum.digitalspy.co.uk/forums/showthread.php?t=981509

Also does not say dissolved here :- http://wck2.companieshouse.gov.uk/e.../companysearch?disp=1&frfsh=1248793007#result

Who told you it had stopped trading ? What is the companies exact name, trading address, registration number etc ?

You can buy accounts information for like a pound from companies house.

 

Fraser mckenzie IT consultants - dissolved.....n 100's of jobless moaning ppl - in debt...

 

there u go guys, i have writen the whole contract so plase read through.

Recruitment agreement

Parties and Definitions

1.1 ‘the recruitment provider’, ‘us’ or ‘we’ means ‘Fraser McKenzie Limited’
1.2 ‘The candidate’, ‘the student’, ‘he’, ‘she’ or ‘you’ means the applicant named on the standard booking form.
1.3 ‘the interviewer’ or ‘employer’ means the organisation with whom your interview is with for the purpose of obtaining employment.
1.4 ‘the job guarantee’ means the specific agreement whereby fraser mckenzie limited agrees to refund the candidate’s course fees in the event s/he is unable to seek employment after meeting the terms and conditions of this agreement.
1.5 ‘the agent’ means person or companies with whom fraser mckenzie ltd have formalised relations to work on their behalf.
1.6 The purpose of this agreement is to clarify the obligations of the Recruitment Provider and the Candidate under the Job Guarantee scheme.

Terms of agreement
2.1 The candidate must have no restrictions on full-time employment in the UK.
2.2 The candidate must commit to the employment with Fraser McKenzie or partner organisations for minimum of 2 years upon gaining the said examinations to be eligible for the FREE TRAINING & JOB GUARANTEE SCHEME, alternatively must of gained all said examinations and be placed into employment with external client whereby Fraser McKenzie receives a job placement fee from client.
2.3 The candidate must complete and pass ALL examinations and assessments specified in the course outline for the course they are doing.
2.4 The candidate must have paid their fees in full at the time of enrolment on the course either via cash/cheque/credit card or via PPI’s deferred Payment Scheme.
2.5 The Job Guarantee comes into effect once the candidate satisfactory completes all the modules and their accompanying examinations in their chosen course area where their course offers a Job Guarantee within a twelve month period from the date they receive their log in codes for their course and have met the terms and conditions of this agreement. For those courses where a Job Guarantee is offered (the career options: helpdesk/systems administrator, network engineer, web developer, it recruitment consultant or it sales executive), all modules and examinations contained in that course on the web page and all accompanying examinations for those modules contained on the Exam info page on the web site must be completed. The candidate must pass all examinations where there are exams for those courses listed (see Exam Info page to view the list of exams).
2.6 No part of this agreement can be altered without the written confirmation from the Directors of Fraser McKenzie Limited.
2.7 The candidate confirms they are unaware of any adverse health or mental problems they have that could severely jeopardise their chances of seeking employment at the time of reading this agreement.
2.8 All refund requests must be made in writing. All refunds will be made either by cheque, postal order, bank transfer or reimbursement to a debit or credit card.
2.9 The terms of this guarantee do not affect your statutory rights.

The Recruitment Provider’s Obligation
3.1 The recruitment provider agrees to refund the candidate’s course fees in full in the event s/he is unable to seek employment after completing the said modules and obtaining the said certifications as per specified in this agreement within the designated time frame and has failed to find employment within 90 day period after the s/he has completed the said modules and accompanying examinations as per specified on the reverse of this page.
3.2 No other course or combination of courses other than those specified in this agreement qualifies for the Job Guarantee scheme unless you receive a letter from the Directors of Fraser McKenzie Limited clearly stating otherwise.
3.3 The duration of your employment, hours, work mode, and location is entirely at the discretion of your employer who will have employed you based on their decision of your discussion with them. The course provider shall not be responsible to you or for your employment status thereafter.
3.4 Where a candidate obtains employment through no assistance of Fraser McKenzie during the twelve month training period specified in this agreement, or the candidate makes themselves unavailable for employment (by whatever means) within the 90 day period after completing their said modules within the specified time, the recruitment agreement shall be void.
3.5 The recruitment provider may help in arranging interviews at their discretion which you must attend for the purposes of securing employment either directly or through an agent appointed by us.
3.5 The recruitment provider agrees to make payments directly into candidate’s bank account to cover cost of training on basis s/he has selected the deferred payment option, and has completed the said modules and accompanying examinations within the designated timeframe of Job Guarantee Scheme.

Candidate’s/Student’s Obligation
4.1 In order for a candidate to be entitled to the benefit of the Job Guarantee scheme, s/he must pass all the exams or assessments comprised within the said modules of this agreement within a twelve month period from the date this agreement was made.
4.2 The candidate must have paid their fees in full at the time of enrolment on the course either via cash/cheque/credit card or via PPI’s deferred Payment Scheme.
4.3 The candidate must pass all examinations relating to the said modules and any written practical and placement tests submitted by the course provider.
4.4 The candidate must submit to the course provider proof of all examinations and assessments passed, including transcripts from the certificate issuer.
4.5 The candidate must commence their employment search following the completion of the said modules and passed all examinations and assessments relating to these modules and provide evidence by way of rejection or approval letters on headed paper from employers they have applied to. Candidates must also provide contact telephone numbers of the employers to confirm their application for employment.
4.6 The candidate must attend all interviews the recruitment provider puts them forward for.
4.7 The candidate must elect to work for Fraser McKenzie or partner organisation to be eligible for FREE Training/Guaranteed Employment Scheme, alternatively must be placed into employment whereby Fraser McKenzie obtain a job placement fee from the client.
4.8 The candidate will accept any reasonable job offer by the recruitment provider where the minimum salary is £17,000 - £22,000 p.a. gross or more.
4.9 The candidate must not decline any reasonable offer for an interview or employment where the employer is offering a minimum salary of £17,000 - £22,000 p.a. gross or above.
4.10 The candidate must present themselves professionally and with genuine conviction to seek the role offered by the employer. This will be confirmed by way of contact with the employer. The candidate will forfeit their Job Guarantee agreement in the event the recruitment provider receives information from an interviewer that you acted or carried yourself in such a manner where you deliberately sabotaged your chances of successful employment.
4.11 Where the candidate has accepted any employment irrespective of length of service, working hours, part-time, full-time, contract/ freelance or permanent with an external employer or a minimum weekly salary above the course provider’s stated salary, the Job Guarantee Agreement becomes void.

btw all the weird stuff like two of he same numbers were in the contract so i just wrote it EXACTLY how they did, do plase dont tease me about my poor english :P

 

So... you're simply going to believe the research (or lack thereof) of 100s of "jobless moaning ppl"... none of whom did the proper amount research to avoid these scams in the first place?

 

and i was told it by a woman called Sahmeda from careers for ppl which apparently has been asked to provide everyone with FMK director'smobile number, which i have but goes directly to voicemail. surprise surprise.

i just dont know what to do. and i feel exhausted now....

 

My goodness... there are so many loopholes in that agreement, it's not even funny.

 

Continue to fight the fight (and be exhausted), beating your head against the wall... or chalk it up as a loss and move on with your life.

 

yeaaa i have done my reasearch along with my bofriend and there was NOTHING dodgy looking about it all back in mid 2008. and it doesnt change the fact i am hoping there is a way of gettng this money back. I'm sorry but i dont think that this company going bust should take all my man's life savings away from him. if i didnt do what was ased of me i the contract then of course it is my fauls, but as i did i want the money!!!

 

oh, thank u. what about the contract? is there really nothing i can do? why should i give up? it i not a 100 quid we're talking about but 5 grand that i should not have to be paying seeing i have completed all that was asked of me in the contract. isn't the contranct binding both sides? what am i missing??????????????

 

I'm sorry to say this, but if you thought there was nothing dodgy looking about all of this back in mid 2008, then you didn't do your research. This has been going on for years and years and years. Although I haven't searched myself, you likely could have found the information here on this very forum.

Not trying to belittle you, Natt... not at all. I feel bad that you got taken for a ride. But the information was out there.

 

What I'm saying is that there are a horrible number of loopholes in that contract. They are highly likely to find something that you didn't complete that will release them of their obligation. For example, all they have to do is say you didn't complete one of the assessment tests and you'll be on the hook for the money.

 

:/ i am sooooo screwed over ;( honestly, shall i go to cab? do u think it is worth going to my man' bank with both cotracts?

 

That's entirely up to you, and you would not be wrong to do so. But there's a reason why these jokers (and others!!) continue to do these same scams over and over and over under different business names... it's because it works for them more often than it fails for them.

 

we r being blamed 4 not doing our research....well there was nothing abt FM at the time i signed...i did research them n all i found was a crap FM website which i was told is being updated it still isn't....were complaining of MISINFORMATION and LIES if i can call it....

 

that's cold logic... true, there is a reason why these people don't end up locked up somewhere as dangerous to sosciety.

is it worth speaking to a solicitor? are there any solicitors that wouldn' charge me for their advice?

 

i agree with strawberry about only the fm crappy website being about. this is exactly what we came across.

mind you with a bit of common sense i should have wondered why the it recruiter's site looks like rubish i could probably make with a bit of patience and no qualifications. but i didn't.

i considered some buttkicking but i dont suppose that will pay the debt off so i'm stuck in front of my comp searching ways of going back in time. no? nothin? daaaaaaaammmmmmm.....

all i can say is i am very disappointed with myself, i really didn't think of myself as naive. got my lesson..

i still haven't lost my hope... got the very last bit of it......

 

Go and speak to CAB, go to free legal advice / consumer advice websites, better yet leave your PC and go and talk to a solicitor, many of them do free initial consultations.

If the company indeed are bankrupt you are probably flogging a dead horse, make sure you get all the details recorded with OFT, Trading Standards et al and move on.

 

You really think the research wasn't out there regarding these kind of training companies? Would you like for me to find the research for you? When did you sign?

Nobody's saying that you are wrong and FMK is right, so please, get over yourself. We call those agreements "scams" because that's what they are, and you are not to blame for the problem. However, had you done your research, you wouldn't have put yourself in a position to be taken by them.

Again, let me make this clear: what they did was wrong. You did NOT deserve what happened to you. But you basically did the equivalent of walking through a crime-filled neighborhood with gold chains around your neck, diamond rings on your fingers, and money hanging out of your pocket.

 

Don't let it eat you up inside. I got taken too - not by a training provider, but by someone who I thought to be a friend. Back in the 90s, we started a game store. I was supposed to front the money for the inventory, and he was supposed to sell the products. Well, I did, and he didn't, and the entire time, he lived off the revenue. Left me almost $50,000 in 20% credit card debt... and with me making $9.83 an hour (about $20K a year).

I didn't throw myself a pity party, and I didn't take bankruptcy... I rolled up my sleeves, and I knocked out every bit of the debt over the next 9 years. And I never saw a dime from "my friend". But ya know what? I didn't expect to... it was MY stupidity that got me into the mess I was in, so I got myself out.

I would venture to say that you're in a much smaller hole and you're in a much better position that I was. You CAN overcome this setback. It sucks, and it'll take some work... along with a bunch of staying home eating soup and noodles... but you'll find your way out of this mess IF you are determined to do so. I can say that definitively, because I've been there with a zero on the end of it.

Pick yourself up, dust yourself off, and succeed despite the problem.