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Experience Level

Discussion in 'MCDST' started by Rob1234, Jan 21, 2008.

  1. Rob1234

    Rob1234 Megabyte Poster

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    I notice that when someone mentions they are doing a MCSE or CCNA people ask if they have the right level of experience and when they say no everyone repeats the same answers you do not have enough experience do A+ N+ MCDST look for job, but I was looking on the Microsoft and CompTIA websites today and they say for the N+ “it is recommended that CompTIA Network+ candidates have at least nine months of experience in network support or administration or adequate academic training” and for the MCDST it says “An MCDST candidate should have 6-12 months of experience supporting end-users of a desktop operating system.” So why does everyone keep telling people with no experience to do these certs? Are people just repeating what everyone else says? I know you can do these without experience but you can also do the MCSE without experience.
     
    Certifications: A few.
  2. greenbrucelee
    Highly Decorated Member Award

    greenbrucelee Zettabyte Poster

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    I think this thread has been on before.

    The A+, N+ and MCDST are entry level certs as for what is recommended experience wise it does actuall say something like the A+ requires atleast a few hundred hours, but I think when its specifically on about the A+ and N+ its talking about general experience not in a workplace environment but as for the MCDST a bit of both is recommended.

    Once you pass these level of certs to higher levels then Work experience is a must because most people can retain info and pass an exam but can you apply the knowledge to the real world whilst under pressure etc that is why certs like MCSE should be done with experience.

    Edit: I always new about MCSE and alway knew before I even joined CF that cert is beyond people with no real world experience.
     
    Certifications: A+, N+, MCDST, Security+, 70-270
    WIP: 70-620 or 70-680?
  3. Rob1234

    Rob1234 Megabyte Poster

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    Certifications: A few.
  4. wagnerk
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    wagnerk aka kitkatninja Moderator

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    Professional certifications should reflect your job role/responsibilities otherwise it really is a "empty" bit of paper.

    Anyway...

    For the A+:

    see here

    For the Network+:

    see here

    For the MCDST:

    Again the MCDST is Microsoft's entry level professional certification, in the beginning MS did state the 6 months of experience before hand, however they have now removed it from the certification requirements, see here (it's gone) - they have not removed it from the MCSA, MCSE and the MCITP, etc certifications though.

    -Ken
     
    Certifications: CITP, PGCert, BSc, HNC, LCGI, PTLLS, MCT, MCITP, MCTS, MCSE, MCSA:M, MCSA, MCDST, MCP, MTA, MCAS, MOS (Master), A+, N+, S+, ACA, VCA, etc... & 2nd Degree Black Belt
    WIP: PGDip
  5. greenbrucelee
    Highly Decorated Member Award

    greenbrucelee Zettabyte Poster

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    Yes but being entry level means they can be done with common sense and bit of knowledge, if someone has never used a PC before or resolved a problem with their PC before then they would stuggle. As for the A+ learning the knowledge in the books will help.

    The reason people say you must have experience to do the MCSA, MCSE etc is because they are looked as usless by employers 'paper MCSE' without experience, the lower certs like A+, N+ and MCDST are looked on as useful by employers in the knowledge & theory department.
     
    Certifications: A+, N+, MCDST, Security+, 70-270
    WIP: 70-620 or 70-680?
  6. Rob1234

    Rob1234 Megabyte Poster

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    Hi wagnerk,

    I knew the A+ needed no experience that is why I did not mention it. As for the N+ I know it is not requried but they recommend it but Microsoft recommend experience for the MCSE they do not requrie it, and for the MCDST this link says you need 6-12 months
     
    Certifications: A few.
  7. Rob1234

    Rob1234 Megabyte Poster

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    GBL, I see what you mean the things that N+ teach are quite basic not sure about MCDST have not started it yet, that's why I was surprised that they were entry level but they still recommend experience, I thought they would be like the A+ that does not really recommend any experience.
     
    Certifications: A few.
  8. BosonMichael
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    BosonMichael Yottabyte Poster

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    For the Network+ and MCDST, it'd be better to have experience before attempting them. However, employers don't really hold the negative views of people who have "Network+ and no experience" or "MCDST and no experience" as they do with "CCNA and no experience" or "MCSA/MCSE and no experience"

    The CCNA doesn't have any recommended experience level at all. Does that mean that you should go pursue it without experience?

    Ultimately, you don't have to follow our advice or ANY of the vendors' recommendations. After all, they're not prerequisites - they're simply recommendations. However, what we state on the forum is what we believe based on what employers look for. Use it... or ignore it... it's up to you. :)
     
    Certifications: CISSP, MCSE+I, MCSE: Security, MCSE: Messaging, MCDST, MCDBA, MCTS, OCP, CCNP, CCDP, CCNA Security, CCNA Voice, CNE, SCSA, Security+, Linux+, Server+, Network+, A+
    WIP: Just about everything!
  9. Logicum

    Logicum Bit Poster

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    I am just taking an MCDST after some years of working on networks and installing and configuring servers etc. I have different bits of paper and a degree in IT, but didn't want to ignore the guidelines set down for things like the MCSA and required experience because you either defraud yourself if you do this and/or your prospective or current employer. Know your stuff and then show it is how one person described it to me.

    At the end of the day it's your life and only you know how much you can do and what kind of study will be required to get you to the level you need to be at to fulfill your goals. If the guidelines of nine months or whatever don't seem that much because you have been tinkering with computers for so long anyway you probably can get a feel for the subject without the experience on an actual network, then that would probably get you through. If you are just starting out in IT and have only ever used a computer for email or gaming etc., then get yourself on the A+ and work progressively through the system (A+, N+, MCDST, MCSA etc). I find that each course builds on its predecessor and adds knowledge needed that helps you understand the next.

    I could be completely barmy and get totally flamed for what I just said. Ultimately (like I said) the ball is in your court. Good luck with whatever you decide to do! :oops:
     
    WIP: Many
  10. sunn

    sunn Gigabyte Poster

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    Whether the vendor says you need experience or not is one thing. Real life is another. The people on this forum see various folks attempting to do “high level” certs only to be classified as worthless paper cert holders. :cry:

    It’s not that that knowledge gained in preparing for the cert is tainted. It’s that a certification implies you’ve qualified and earned your stripes in the industry. You have several yrs under your belt and know how to face real life situations and the stress that goes with it. :blink

    The A+, Network+, MCDST are examples of certifications that employers have accepted to have some value from individuals with limited or no experience. For example, for an Intermediate role, Adam has 6-yrs of Sys Admin experience with no A+, but his duties included looking after some servers, workstations and parts of the network and the 'competition' is certified with an A+ but no experience, Adam will get the job. If the new role called for a junior position that would complete a task list set by seniors, the inexperienced person may get the job based on he/she would be cheaper, but eager to do well. The A+ shows that! A CCNA or MCSE shows the individual wants to take an easy way to the top. An employer may also see that as someone who can’t make a commitment or face adversity (always looking for a shortcut).
     
  11. Spilly

    Spilly Kilobyte Poster

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    These people wouldn't be wanting to sell a training package to you would they?
     
    Certifications: A+,N+,S+,MCP,MCDST,MCITP,MCTS,MCSA,CISMP,PCI-P,SSCP
    WIP: CCSK

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