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Confused MCSE?

Discussion in 'General Microsoft Certifications' started by Luddym, Nov 3, 2008.

  1. Luddym

    Luddym Megabyte Poster

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    I received an E-Mail from Microsoft today to tell me I'm now a Microsoft Certified Systems Engineer. It threw me a little as I'm pretty sure I'm still the elective away from becoming MCSE, but looking at my Microsoft transcript it still shows me a an MCSE.

    I took my MCSA using the A+ and N+ as electives, and the Microsoft Exams I have taken are:

    70-270
    70-290
    70-291
    70-293
    70-294
    70-297

    By my reckoning, I'm still an elective away from my MCSE as the A+ and N+ count towards the MCSA but not the MCSE.

    Can anyone see where my reasoning is going wrong?

    Edit : I tried looking at the Cert planner on the MCP site to see if that would shed any lights on it, but the planner would only show the path for 'certs I don't have'.
     
    Certifications: VCP,A+, N+, MCSA, MCSE
    WIP: Christmas Drunkard
  2. simongrahamuk
    Honorary Member

    simongrahamuk Hmmmmmmm?

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    does the MCSA itself not count as an elective?
     
  3. onoski

    onoski Terabyte Poster

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    You're still better off getting the information from the horses mouth in my opinion. To be honest there might have just been a mix up. But hey, just check and best wishes:)
     
    Certifications: MCSE: 2003, MCSA: 2003 Messaging, MCP, HNC BIT, ITIL Fdn V3, SDI Fdn, VCP 4 & VCP 5
    WIP: MCTS:70-236, PowerShell
  4. Luddym

    Luddym Megabyte Poster

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    I think it's only the 2000 MCSA but not the MCSA 2003 that counts towards the MCSE 2003
     
    Certifications: VCP,A+, N+, MCSA, MCSE
    WIP: Christmas Drunkard
  5. simongrahamuk
    Honorary Member

    simongrahamuk Hmmmmmmm?

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  6. Obinna Osobalu

    Obinna Osobalu Banned

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    Actually you have already taking the 4 core networking exams(290, 291, 293, 294) one client(270) and one core design(297) so it seems like you are short one exam which is one elective... below is the list of elective exams
    Exam 70-086
    Exam 70-089
    Exam 70-227
    Exam 70-228
    Exam 70-229
    Exam 70-235
    Exam 70-236
    Exam 70-262
    Exam 70-281
    Exam 70-282
    Exam 70-284
    Exam 70-285
    Exam 70-297
    Exam 70-298
    Exam 70-299
    Exam 70-301
    Exam 70-350
    Exam 70-351
    Exam 70-400
    Exam 70-401
    Exam 70-431
    Exam 70-445
    Exam 70-500
    Exam 70-557
    Exam 70-620
    Exam 70-624
    Exam 70-630
    Exam 70-631
    Exam 70-638
    All said and done think that might be a mix up.. All the best though
     
    Certifications: MCITP:SA,MCTS(x5),MCSE2K3;MCSA2K3:M;MCP
    WIP: EDA7,70-652,Project+,MSP(70-632)
  7. r.h.lee

    r.h.lee Gigabyte Poster

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    Luddym,

    According to the Certification Planner for the MCSE 2003 it states:
    1. MCSA W2K3 Upgrade (All *)
      1. Design Core (1 *)
        1. Exam #297 Designing a Microsoft Windows Server 2003 Active Directory and Network Infrastructure
      2. Electives (2 *)
        1. CompTIA A+ and CompTIA Network+
    2. MCSA Windows 2003
    3. Exam #293 Planning and Maintaining a Microsoft Windows Server 2003 Network Infrastructure
    4. Exam #294 Planning, Implementing, and Maintaining a Microsoft Windows Server 2003 Active Directory Infrastructure

    It seems that Microsoft gave you MCSA 2003 elective credit for being CompTIA A+ and CompTIA Network+ certified that led to being MCSA 2003 certified. After achieving the MCSA 2003 certification, you were now in the "MCSA W2K3 Upgrade" track towards the MCSE 2003 certification. As listed above, being MCSA 2003 certified met the "MCSA Windows 2003" requirement towards MCSE 2003 certification. Then, it seems like Microsoft granted you elective credit towards the MCSE 2003 certification requirements with your CompTIA A+ and CompTIA Network+ certifications. So it seems like your reasoning was "wrong" by assuming that Microsoft would count your CompTIA A+ and CompTIA Network+ certifications as an elective only once.

    Are you now less confused why you achieved MCSE 2003 certification? If this is your first MCSE certification, welcome among us my MCSE brother. :)
     
    Certifications: MCSE, MCP+I, MCP, CCNA, A+
    WIP: CCDA
  8. Sparky
    Highly Decorated Member Award

    Sparky Zettabyte Poster Moderator

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    When did this change happen? I completed the A+ and Network+ but could only use it as an elective for the MCSA. :blink
     
    Certifications: MSc MCSE MCSA:M MCSA:S MCITP:EA MCTS(x5) Security+ Network+ A+
    WIP: Exchange 2007\2010
  9. r.h.lee

    r.h.lee Gigabyte Poster

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    Sparky,

    Effective at least as of the time I went into the Certification Planner to look up the current requirements for the MCSE 2003 while I was composing my reply to LuddyM. :)
     
    Certifications: MCSE, MCP+I, MCP, CCNA, A+
    WIP: CCDA
  10. BosonMichael
    Highly Decorated Member Award

    BosonMichael Yottabyte Poster

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    Don't measure a spot on the wall for your certificate just yet... this wouldn't be the first time Microsoft has mistakenly granted certifications. They granted me (and one or two other users on this forum) the MCITP: EST certification even though I had not taken the 70-621 or 70-622. I would recommend that you contact Microsoft Learning (mcphelp@microsoft.com, if my memory works today).
     
    Certifications: CISSP, MCSE+I, MCSE: Security, MCSE: Messaging, MCDST, MCDBA, MCTS, OCP, CCNP, CCDP, CCNA Security, CCNA Voice, CNE, SCSA, Security+, Linux+, Server+, Network+, A+
    WIP: Just about everything!
  11. Luddym

    Luddym Megabyte Poster

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    Looks like a Microsoft blunder.....

    Still an elective to go afterall.
     
    Certifications: VCP,A+, N+, MCSA, MCSE
    WIP: Christmas Drunkard
  12. BosonMichael
    Highly Decorated Member Award

    BosonMichael Yottabyte Poster

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    Not much longer, and you'll have it legitimately anyway. :)
     
    Certifications: CISSP, MCSE+I, MCSE: Security, MCSE: Messaging, MCDST, MCDBA, MCTS, OCP, CCNP, CCDP, CCNA Security, CCNA Voice, CNE, SCSA, Security+, Linux+, Server+, Network+, A+
    WIP: Just about everything!
  13. Luddym

    Luddym Megabyte Poster

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    Only if you count taking the Vista client exam (70-620) as an elective as still being 'legitimate'. :twisted:
     
    Certifications: VCP,A+, N+, MCSA, MCSE
    WIP: Christmas Drunkard
  14. BosonMichael
    Highly Decorated Member Award

    BosonMichael Yottabyte Poster

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    Well, you've already got 70-270, right? I believe you CAN use a second client exam for an elective.
     
    Certifications: CISSP, MCSE+I, MCSE: Security, MCSE: Messaging, MCDST, MCDBA, MCTS, OCP, CCNP, CCDP, CCNA Security, CCNA Voice, CNE, SCSA, Security+, Linux+, Server+, Network+, A+
    WIP: Just about everything!
  15. Obinna Osobalu

    Obinna Osobalu Banned

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    Visit this site http://certification.comptia.org/mcsa/default.aspx. It actually gives info on your "confusion"
     
    Certifications: MCITP:SA,MCTS(x5),MCSE2K3;MCSA2K3:M;MCP
    WIP: EDA7,70-652,Project+,MSP(70-632)
  16. BosonMichael
    Highly Decorated Member Award

    BosonMichael Yottabyte Poster

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    Actually, it doesn't... because the certification was given to him erroneously, as Luddy mentioned. Luddy already knew that the A+ and Network+ can be used as an elective for the MCSA, but not the MCSE.
     
    Certifications: CISSP, MCSE+I, MCSE: Security, MCSE: Messaging, MCDST, MCDBA, MCTS, OCP, CCNP, CCDP, CCNA Security, CCNA Voice, CNE, SCSA, Security+, Linux+, Server+, Network+, A+
    WIP: Just about everything!
  17. r.h.lee

    r.h.lee Gigabyte Poster

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    Ok, here's the current screen capture for the MCSE 2003 requirements in the Certification Planner as of 05NOV2008. Notice how it clearly states:

    • Microsoft Certified Systems Engineer - Microsoft Windows Server 2003
      • Requirement Set 1881. Base (1 *)
        • Admin W2K Upgrade (All *)
        • MCSA W2K3 Upgrade (All *)
          • Design Core (1 *)
          • Electives (2 *)
            • CompTIA A+ and CompTIA Network +
     
    Certifications: MCSE, MCP+I, MCP, CCNA, A+
    WIP: CCDA
  18. BosonMichael
    Highly Decorated Member Award

    BosonMichael Yottabyte Poster

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    Yes, I know what it says. But like I said, I was erroneously granted the MCITP: EST, and it stated on the Certification Planner than I had indeed achieved the MCITP: EST by having the MCDST and taking 70-620... but the Certification Planner and their tracking system were wrong, because you can't get the MCITP:EST by having the MCDST and taking 70-620. It took a couple of months, but they eventually fixed the problem in the Planner and in their certification database. So, when Microsoft eventually figures out what's causing this problem, the discrepancy in their Planner will disappear... because the A+ and Network+ are not valid electives for the MCSE, as confirmed by calling Microsoft.
     
    Certifications: CISSP, MCSE+I, MCSE: Security, MCSE: Messaging, MCDST, MCDBA, MCTS, OCP, CCNP, CCDP, CCNA Security, CCNA Voice, CNE, SCSA, Security+, Linux+, Server+, Network+, A+
    WIP: Just about everything!
  19. Luddym

    Luddym Megabyte Poster

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    UPDATE:

    After receiving an initial E-Mail from Microsoft saying my status had been updated incorrectly, I then received an E-Mail a few days later saying that the case was being investigated......

    Fast forward to today, and I receive this:



    So it looks like I am an MCSE, though I'm still confused. :twisted:

    http://www.microsoft.com/learning/mcp/mcse/windows2003/default.mspx

     
    Certifications: VCP,A+, N+, MCSA, MCSE
    WIP: Christmas Drunkard
  20. r.h.lee

    r.h.lee Gigabyte Poster

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    Luddym,

    It's just the nature of boolean algebra to automate decision-making programs. According to the "MCSE on Windows Server 2003 Certification Requirements" webpage, it says...
    Think of the above as a checklist where each component is a check mark, either yes or no. So the effective equation becomes...

    Code:
     
    
    Four core exams on networking systems + One core exam on client operating systems + One core design exam + One elective exam = MCSE 2003
    
    
    Only if the four components are yes will the result of MCSE 2003 be yes also. Let's take this component by component...

    Code:
    Four core exams on networking systems: [v]
    1) 70-290
    2) 70-291
    3) 70-293
    4) 70-294
    
    One core exam on client operating systems: [v]
    1) 70-270
    
    One core design exam: [v]
    1) 70-297
    
    One elective exam: [v]
    1) 70-297 
    
    So since each of those components got check marks, you've fulfilled all the requirements for MCSE 2003. See, the problem with boolean algebra and the reason why you're being confused, is in order to have the flexibility of "...one time toward a core design exam or an elective exam..." the 70-297 exam has to be double listed in each component's lists. The "cost" of that flexibility is the technical difficulty of enforcing the "....but not both." See, in order to enforce the "...not both..." rule, they'd have to have a complicated system of "If you pass 70-297, then remove 70-298 from the electives list. If you pass 70-298, then remove 70-297 from the electives list." Then the complexity increases because this would have to be on a case by case basis for each MCP instead of a "simple" centralized that the computer program that the Certification Planner is based on. Does this help to reduce your confusion?

    Source:
    1. MCSE on Windows Server 2003 Certification Requirements - http://www.microsoft.com/learning/mcp/mcse/windows2003/default.mspx
     
    Certifications: MCSE, MCP+I, MCP, CCNA, A+
    WIP: CCDA

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