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Complete noob....

Discussion in 'Web Development & Web Hosting' started by danielno8, Jun 30, 2009.

  1. danielno8

    danielno8 Gigabyte Poster

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    Hi folks,

    I have next to no knowledge of any form of programming, web design etc etc.

    Our Houston office have developed a site which allows clients to RSVP to events our company organise.

    I have been asked if we can create something similar.

    The one they use was developed with visual studio.

    What happens is an email is sent out to all clients, with a link to accept or decline. If they accept it brings up a page with fields for the client to input their name etc. once this is done (this is where my knowledge of what happens gets a little hazy) the data is put into a SQL database, and a report is generated and the data can be fed into excel, and somehow into allowing name badges to be printed off.

    How much time (how long is a peice of string i know..) do you think it would take to create something like this, given my lack of knowledge on this subject? is it even feasable?

    Any advice any of you can give me on this would be great

    thanks
     
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  2. Qs

    Qs Semi-Honorary Member Gold Member

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    In the nicest way possible ... You're in over your head.

    There's no way someone is going to be able to hand-hold you through all of this with absolutely no experience.

    Just say you can't do it, it's not feasible.

    Qs
     
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  3. greenbrucelee
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    greenbrucelee Zettabyte Poster

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    I created something similar at uni using delphi (if i remember correctly) and basic html. Things have obviously moved on since then so I am not sure what you would use.

    it took me two one hour classes to create along with the database which was dome PL/SQL and oracle which took an hour to create a thousand records.
     
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  4. BosonMichael
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    BosonMichael Yottabyte Poster

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    I once worked for a company that was asked to do IT support for a large insurance company that went into receivership when the owner took the money and ran. The insurance database was more-or-less tied together with twine and held together with bubblegum. The programmer had to manually tweak their COBOL apps to get it to do what was required.

    My IT manager asked me to shadow the COBOL programmer to see if I could learn - and reproduce - what things he had to do on a regular basis. After watching the programmer for a couple days, I told my IT manager that there was no way that even a trained COBOL programmer could come in from the outside and understand what he had to do to keep the customer records updated. In short, I was over my head, and I wasn't shy about telling him so.

    How much time would it take for you to develop something like that? Depends on how quickly you can learn to program AND learn how to do database design and administration.
     
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  5. danielno8

    danielno8 Gigabyte Poster

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    lmao pretty much what i was expecting.

    Where does one start in order to get to a level able to do this?

    I mean, the site looks very simple, and what it does doesn't sound too complex. This is clearly not a representation of what is involved in getting it to work.

    Anyway, whether i do it for this event or not, its made me want to look into it and learn about it, even if its just to get a clearer picture of what is happening behind the scenes rather then learn exactly hwo to do it (one day perhaps)

    Where would you suggest i start?

    I also wasn't expecting anyone to hold my hand through this, just pointers on where to go to get info, work out what the different technologies involved in doing it actually are.

    Thansk for the replies guys.
     
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  6. dmarsh

    dmarsh Terabyte Poster

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    Theres really no way we can determine how long you will take, it depends on the individual, it does sound like a fairly straightforward task given todays technology.

    As greenbrucelee says, its the sort of thing you might be asked to do for a college project over a few weeks. It really depends on the details, sometimes clients tell you they have a simple requirement and the more you look at it the more requirements spring out of the woodwork.

    It sounds like the houston version is something like ASP .NET, C#, IIS, and SQL Server. These are the technologies you would need to understand. Along with possibly a little HTML, CSS, JavaScript, TCP/IP, SQL etc.

    Trouble is it sounds like you don't know anything, normally people pick up a programming language, some web skills and SQL at college. They'd then have a fighting chance of getting it done.

    I'd start with a book on C#, a book on SQL and a book on ASP .NET.

    Some approaches dive straight into an ASP .Net project and hope the student can pick up all the rest along the way. Many TP's seem to take this approach, also some Wrox books. Personally I wouldn't reccomend this approach, theres doing it quick and doing it right. Taking short cuts on the fundamentals of your education is probably not a smart move.

    You really want to build a proper foundation with your first programming language. This generally involves learning all the features and syntax and basic design. You generally spend a long time writing lots of different very small programs.
     
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  7. BosonMichael
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    BosonMichael Yottabyte Poster

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    At the bottom. :)

    Not trying to be flippant... it's the short version of exactly what DM said above. :)
     
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  8. danielno8

    danielno8 Gigabyte Poster

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    yeh at uni we did programming, which i managed fine and was in C++ i think. that probably tells you how much i remember of it in itself. However, when i did it (about 4/5 years ago) i don't remember finding it THAT difficult to pick up, albeit it was probably very simple programs.

    Houston page was a combination of ASP and SQL. I do know SQL as far as managing databases, permissions etc but don't think that will be of any massive contribution to the project i would like to complete. Also time is not an issue, as it sounds i won't be able to do this in a couple of months, which is when they would be sending out invites, i'll tell them it can't be done and i can work on learning it should they need it in the future.

    Any websites you guys know of off the top of your head for beginners? Any more advice, info wanrnings etc fire them in.

    Appreciate you guys taking the time to respond.
     
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  9. danielno8

    danielno8 Gigabyte Poster

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    yeh this is where i'd imagine lol

    but as you can tell i don't know where the bottom is.....
     
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  10. dmarsh

    dmarsh Terabyte Poster

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    If you really do already know TCP/IP, HTML, HTTP, C++, XML, SQL and windows server admin then really you should have most of the skills already.

    You can transition fron C++ to C#, its an OO programming language and the syntax is similar. If you knew Visual C++/MFC/Win32, much of the .NET framework is similar.

    If you know C# and HTML, and basics of HTTP/Web Servers then learning ASP .NET which is basically a template programing language is not that hard.

    You should be able to pick up basic IIS admin if you can admin windows servers.

    If you already know databases and SQL, SQL server is very easy to pick up.

    If you know C# and SQL, ADO .NET is not too hard to learn.

    Then you are pretty much ready to go, at this point you could look at MSDN, the source code from the houston version, other programming websites, a couple of how to books and probably knock together something functional at least. It probably won't be production quality but you can work on that in V2 :wink:
     
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  11. LukeP

    LukeP Gigabyte Poster

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    Is the email to all customers to be sent by request from staff or scheduled?
    This is a perfect application to learn. Don't give up.
    IIS administration of such website isn't hard so that's out of a way. You are probably capable of creating database tables and users as well.
    Get an evaluation version of Visual Studio (it's really great!). If you haven't had any previous experience with VB.NET by all means go for C#. Install Visual Studio, have a look around it, follow some ASP.NET C# tutorials and slowly start writing your application.

    asp.net - Great site, plenty of tutorials and information
    stackoverflow.com - Great programming Q/A site
    and obviously google, is all you need to get started.

    Programming books while great, sometimes just don't cut it. Either you have a tutorial format which is not relevant to what you want to write (you want to write something, right?) or it's a language reference format which basically covers information covered on the web (and easier to find, copy/paste).

    Start on paper. Draw what you want to achieve, any special requirements, who's goning to use it, and how. Write down even the most obvious things, it will just make it easier during the process. Once you got it down on paper, start googling around and follow simple relevant tutorials (like how to query the database, how to send emails, how to manage access to certain pages).

    ASP.NET MVC is great but it's not designed for something you want to achieve in this project so don't bother. Web Forms is the way to go on this one.
    Don't get scared. Everyone starts somewhere.
    I am more than happy to help you further, just drop me a PM with your email and we can take it from there. I would tell my boss, I can't do it and I'd just do it for myself as been said before, though.

    BTW: Can you use the source code from Houston, if yes it comes down to changing bits and pieces which can be an easiest solution.
     
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  12. danielno8

    danielno8 Gigabyte Poster

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    Thanks for the reply. Will let you know once v1 is complete :)

    Those links look good, I plan on watching through the tutorial videos, using google and seeing where it takes me. Thanks for the offer of help, keep an eye on your PM box :D

    Will keep this thread updated with progress!
     
    Certifications: CCENT, CCNA
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