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Can you recommend Media for Archiving?

Discussion in 'The Lounge - Off Topic' started by Enigma101, May 18, 2010.

  1. Enigma101

    Enigma101 Bit Poster

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    I have small amounts of data that i want to store on CD for archiving, can anyone recommend high quality media for this?

    Cant seem to find any tests or reviews on media lifespan?
     
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  2. Phoenix
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    Phoenix 53656e696f7220 4d6f64

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    err, disk+cloud
    :)
     
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  3. Enigma101

    Enigma101 Bit Poster

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    I dont want to store it on cloud thanks...verbatim AZO look like a good choice?
     
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  4. UKDarkstar
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    UKDarkstar Terabyte Poster

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    Try contacting SVP - they have been in the media business for very many years and I am sure they will have some info if you request it.
     
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  5. Phoenix
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    Phoenix 53656e696f7220 4d6f64

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    any justifiable reason? or just read too much FUD in the papers?
    I'd love to hear your opinion

    I generally don't trust any of my backups to single points of failure anymore, so unless your backing up to media in multiple locations you should protect your data in another manner to boot
    fixed media goes wrong, no matter what the archive rating is on the item, it goes wrong, this is why enterprises are moving away from tape, and its why new technology that is disk based (with clever side techs like grid redundancy, data de-duplication and REST storage is gaining ground) personally as a consumer, i love the thought of having enterprise class backups for a tiny price :)

    Taiyo Yuden are one of the popular long life CD brands, but they dont sell under their own brand outside of japan, so a lot of other brands OEM their stuff (TDK, Verbatim) but you will be hard pushed to actually work out the brand of media before the purchase

    I'm not sure trusting your files to CDs in this day and age is a good idea, its akin to burying it under the back lawn and hoping for the best 10 years later

    What are you specific goals here? archive duration? platform support? filetypes? amount of data? remember anything your looking to keep more than a few years you need to factor in the ability to actually access that data in the future
     
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  6. BosonMichael
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    BosonMichael Yottabyte Poster

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    I don't hear any FUD... I just don't like storing my data where I don't have full control over it.

    Plus, there's really no need to do so, what with several local options for data storage that are currently available. If I had any data I wanted to make sure I kept, I'd back it up to multiple locations, as you mention.
     
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  7. Enigma101

    Enigma101 Bit Poster

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    Sure it will be backed up in multiple locations.

    Cloud storage is a bit of a grey area (excuse the pun) you dont know where the data is being stored and what privacy,security and laws apply in the country that is hosting your data?
    For all you know it could be across several data centers, one in the far east another in europe and one in far flung third world where data storage is much cheaper?

    Is the data encrypted when you are accessing it across the cloud? and what level of encryption is the service providing?

    Some People are far to trusting with their data and as far as i am concerned cloud storage is like leaving your pc out on the front lawn overnight.

    But hey thats just my opinion :)
     
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  8. Phoenix
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    Phoenix 53656e696f7220 4d6f64

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    Actually none of this is actually true
    provided you are looking at reputable vendors

    in fact on the front page of many cloud backup vendors sites they answer most of those questions, and many more with a quick glance at the FAQ

    For instance, I use Mozy (an EMC company)
    With Mozy my data is available to me anywhere, its encrypted at rest and in transit (and if you were that worried you would just encrypt your files before backing up no? same way you should to your CD)
    As who has access, well i'm told just me, and this is down to you trusting the vendor you are using, not the technology in play, I certainly wouldnt recommend using Bank of Nikolei offsite data guard for instance

    oh, and it costs me under 5 bucks a month for unlimited data.. about as much as it could cost for a few archive quality CDs and a fraction of what it costs for the decent burner to go with them (the burner itself plays a part in the quality and longevity of the burnt media)

    As for control, well I control when, how much, and how often it gets put there, once it's there as long as I can get it back whenever I choose, that seems to meet my control needs (and the needs of most of my clients) :)
     
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  9. delorean

    delorean Megabyte Poster

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    Personally I'm of a similar belief that I don't trust the cloud entirely yet. At least not with sensitive personal data storage.

    If it's not that sensitive, go with the cloud. If it is, maybe go with a cheap, low capacity HDD and backup the data there.

    The optical disc has had it's day.
     
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  10. jk2447

    jk2447 Petabyte Poster Moderator

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    I agree with Delorean. Cloud computing is the way forward no doubt, but I wouldn't trust anything I wanted to keep top secret, to anyone but myself. On the other hand, no one has mentioned their info being top secret ha ha so cloud it is! Its safe, backed up, encrypted and cheap, what more could you want!

    No in all seriousness, if you had some piece of information that you wouldn't want anyone to see, cloud storage, although encrypted, has storage administrators..... the colonels secret receipe for instance :) If its that important I wouldn't trust the 8th layer of the OSI model :biggrin
     
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  11. Phoenix
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    Phoenix 53656e696f7220 4d6f64

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    if I upload a truecrypt who cares if the storage admin even has file level access to it (he probably does not)
    big whoop, he found my 2048bit encrypted file, whats he gonna do with it? spend 10 years decrypting it? :)

    data theft from mere mortals of often a crime of convenience, so make it inconvenient, unless your a high value target it's unlikely anyone will bother your stuff :)

    thanks for the various viewpoints, it does seem that peoples feelings towards the cloud are still very much rooted in the FUD category, maybe I'll have to put a presentation together on how secure multi-tenancy cloud solutions are actually architected, haha :)
     
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  12. jk2447

    jk2447 Petabyte Poster Moderator

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    Hey with your experience I won't argue and would thank you for a presentation! ha ha

    Totally agree, if you encrypt something (and do a good job) even the clouds employees are taken out of the equation. I'm actually laughing as I'm writting this however, who are we, secret agents? ha ha ha we wish! Family photos are hardly national security ha ha
     
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  13. delorean

    delorean Megabyte Poster

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    Maybe, but I still don't trust the cloud enough even for items such as that. Not yet.

    Every day a story makes the news, granted likely fueled by media fearmongering, regarding privacy online. It's actually surprising how readily we give our identities away (see my blog article on Facebook privacy, click a moleskine in my sig).

    To be honest I don't think I will ever completely let go and let the cloud take control. Not for the forseeable at least. I want to retain that control over what matters to me most. Top secret government file (an extreme example) or family photo, I don't care, it's mine, and right now once it's out there on the cloud, there is a possibility (however slight) it could belong to anyone. That, I continue to find unsettling.
     
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  14. Phoenix
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    Phoenix 53656e696f7220 4d6f64

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    I once again applaud your candid input mate, and I did in fact read your facebook post with much interest, i wont go too into the debate, everyone is of course entitled to their own comfort with technology and will always see it in their eyes, different to how others see or use it (I for instance believe in the personal brand concept, the concept that my presence in the social space opens doors to me going forward, and have seen this first hand, and its exactly because that information about me is public that this brand is promoted, obviously i don't go posting my SSN on facebook, but my phone number is, my email address is, stuff that is all publicly available anywhere else anyway)

    To close, today we all use digital photography and have end to end control of our own processing, but 10 years ago, you took those priced family photos to a shop to have developed, they or their staff could of copied them, scanned them, resold them, turned them in as stock, any number of things, but you had TRUST in them, and that's why you went and had them done, the TRUST model is still required here, you don't just dump your life story up in places without paying careful attention to the fine print, you sir, seem to do just that, good job!

    I apologize to the OP for going a bit off topic, i do love a good chat about the pros/cons of modern and next gen technology though, it's kind of my forte :P
     
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  15. delorean

    delorean Megabyte Poster

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    Thanks for the kind words! Someone reads my blog? Flippin' eck! :biggrin

    I do see the comparisons to be had with the digital photography example. We could however tarnish any analog data/communication with the same brush and end up with the same result.

    The trust model is indeed what is most important. Until a cloud product is available that satisfies that model 100%, I think adaptation to the cloud in particular will be slow at best. But will there indeed ever be such a model? Remember, whatever is engineered by man can always be reverse engineered.

    Forgive me too for straying off of the original topic, but to add some rice to this meaty curry, I'd like to point you to the Diaspora project.

    This has the potential to be hugely successful in social networking circles. If what they are proposing is true, it would present the perfect solution for social networking services. Complete control by you, the user. Control of your data, control of your privacy.

    It's an interesting concept, but is it profitable? And if so, how? Perhaps that's a question we should all ask ourselves, myself included, when we first signed up to Friends Reunited, Bebo, Myspace, Facebook et al.
     
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  16. BosonMichael
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    I direct your attention to my signature line. 8)

    Again, there's no FUD from me. There's simply no reason for me to entrust my data to anyone else when I have perfectly good, stable, safe, secure, and paid-for methods available to me locally. Access? I've got it. Redundancy? I've got it. Security? I've got it.
     
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  17. jk2447

    jk2447 Petabyte Poster Moderator

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    Of course that makes perfect sense, to an expert such as yourself my friend. A person of lesser skill may wish to hand the backup/security/availability etc over to a 3rd party purely because they lack the level of skill/knowledge to do it themselves. Hey I'm gonna get battered for this but what's FUD?
     
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  18. nugget
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    nugget Junior toady

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    I think it would really be appreciated if you have the time Ryan. :thumbleft


    True and there were many cases where the staff did just that, copied the photos for their own purpose. It's just a bit easier with digital photos now.


    Fear Uncertainty Doubt



    You could try putting it on an external HDD instead of CD.



    Personally I'm not ready to trust the cloud just yet. Ryan makes a lot of good points for the use of the cloud but for me it's more a peace of mind thing knowing that my data is backed up on 2 external hdd's sitting on my shelf. Sure they could get stolen, dropped, corrupt (add your own disaster here) but then it's my fault.
     
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  19. BosonMichael
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    BosonMichael Yottabyte Poster

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    It takes no skill to put data on a CD, an external drive, or a flash drive, JK... my 61-year-old mom can do that. And I directed you to my signature line not to stare at my certs, but to take note that some of us are (or, were) secret agents.
     
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  20. jk2447

    jk2447 Petabyte Poster Moderator

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    Oh ha ha sorry mate, completely missed your point didn't I :oops: I can't argue with you fella. I think I'm even dafter than normal today, don't take me out with two to the chest and one in the head please, we're friends! :biggrin
     
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