1. This site uses cookies. By continuing to use this site, you are agreeing to our use of cookies. Learn More.

A+ (2009) released through TP's(Advent)?

Discussion in 'Training & Development' started by Alex399, Oct 12, 2009.

  1. Alex399

    Alex399 Byte Poster

    212
    8
    29
    I am in a situation where I am currently studying Comptia A+ Essentials (220-601)

    I am confused as to why my Training provider (Advent) has given me the 2006 version of the Comptia A+ study guide :x
    as I only recentley joined them in the 2009... well I say recentley but it was the 2nd of february when I signed the dotted line for my handful of certs.

    Having only received the Comptia A+ essentials Study guide a couple of days ago for the 601 exam, Im feeling furious as to why I haven't got the 701 exams ahead of me for the updated Comptia 2009 A+ exams, I'm assuming they had the exam released world wide Jan 09 and have the updated study guide relased world wide, but perhaps I shouldn't assume this is the case on the basis that on the spine of my Comptia A+ book it has "Exam 220-601" but I'm thinking that you need an updated study guide for an updated test of course.. right?

    For the high price Ive paid for my course :x I am going to have a right go at them as to why I'm not offered the most up to date exam and certification available for Comptia A+ since it was released prior to me signing the dotted line (2nd Feb), only a month before infact...

    More importantly is the Comptia A+ updated 2009 exam really going to give me much more knowledge than the older 2006 Comptia A+ exams?

    P.S. For those who wonder why I am so far behind it was due to lack of dedication to the course and some how took me 8 months to get through a "Introduction to Computers and I.T." book :oops:

    (Chapter 2) :D
    This perhaps should be a new thread but I feel like I'm flooding this forum with my threads otherwise 8)

    As far as I'm aware from reading about the Comptia Network+ Cert on Comptia's Official website that the Network + cert is included in the MCSA cert/course... 0_o could someone confirm this is standard for a MCSA to come with a Network+ cert as well.

    Advent lay out the certs as follows in chronilogical order starting with the earliest;
    Comptia A+
    MCP
    MCDST
    MCSA
    MCSE

    Learning from this forum I will leave large gaps in between the certifications to make way for on-the-job experience I would need so I avoid forgetting what I have learn't from passing one exam to the date of when that information becomes valuable in the relevant job role, fingers crossed I don't end up post poning the MCSE 2008 to the point where Microsoft have a newer MS Server version released and a updated test following it but then maybe I could ask my training provider niceley in a couple years time for them to supply the updated study materials and updated exams/certs to me :biggrin:

    My question is, is it worth my hassle to see if my training provider can provide the Network+ cert shortly after completion of my A+ Exams to get more valuable knowledge and to (I'm hoping) increase my chances of getting an entry level role as a Support Tech/desktop support tech?

    Or is the Network+ cert for the more experienced people looking to progress on from the Support tech/Desktop supprt tech role?

    Ive yet to speak to advent to confirm bits of information in this thread but I will update this post following speaking to them
     
    Last edited: Oct 12, 2009
    WIP: A+, N+, MCP, MCDST
  2. soundian

    soundian Gigabyte Poster

    1,460
    71
    107
    If memory serves, it was round about February that CompTIA released the revised objectives so that people could actually start working on new training material. I don't think the release date for the 701/2 was announced until about May.
    I fail to see how you can be p***ed off at your TP for providing you with a course which was the only choice at the time you signed up.
     
    Certifications: A+, N+,MCDST,MCTS(680), MCP(270, 271, 272), ITILv3F, CCENT
    WIP: Knuckling down at my new job
  3. Alex399

    Alex399 Byte Poster

    212
    8
    29
    I "was" pissed off, assuming it was released in Jan, but still were in October now... so I take it they don't update there exams and study materials they supply with the huge price tag that comes with there courses... my fault I guess for taking the damn course with the TP and not asking them if they update exams/certs as time passes while on your course :dry but I'm stuck with them anyhow.
    Shame that... :eek: as I mentioned though is there much change to the updated A+ Exam does anyone know?
     
    Last edited: Oct 12, 2009
    WIP: A+, N+, MCP, MCDST
  4. greenbrucelee
    Highly Decorated Member Award

    greenbrucelee Zettabyte Poster

    14,283
    254
    329
    The A+ 2006/7 is still available until next summer although the new one will start earlier (apparently). It doesn't matter to employers which version you have all they want to know is that you have it.

    The new version will have questions on Vista in it and I think it includes a practicle element to it.

    The A+,N+ and MCDST are entry level and you shouldn't do any more than this until you have the proper working experience as stated by Microsoft.

    Having the A+ and N+ count towards the elective for the MCSA but unless you are on some course where it is inlcuded it is not part of the MCSA material but then again you shouldn't be going for the MCSA unless you have 6 - 12 months experience of being a network admin.
     
    Last edited: Oct 12, 2009
    Certifications: A+, N+, MCDST, Security+, 70-270
    WIP: 70-620 or 70-680?
  5. JonnyMX

    JonnyMX Petabyte Poster

    5,239
    211
    236
    Advent probably don't realise that it's changed.
    As long as people keep handing over cash for it, they'll keep selling it.

    It's a classic case of 'buyer beware'.
    The real question could be 'why did you go to a TP and buy an out of date course'?
    It's a bit like going and buying a new TV without Freeview.

    Anyway, not to worry - just make sure that you sit your exams before they retire.
    You can still put A+ on your CV and nobody is going to ask which one it was.
    They are both relevant and it won't cause you any problems.

    But, as always, there is a message out there for everyone.
    Like buying a TV, a PC or a car - do your homework before hand. Don't rely on a salesman to tell you everything you need to know. Most of them haven't got a clue about IT or certification and only know what they've read on the brochure.

    It's not too hard.
    CIW, CompTIA and Microsoft all have up to date information about their certs on their websites - new exams, pre-requirements and upcoming retirements. It's a matter of minutes to check up on them.

    Even so, you also need to remember that things never stand still in IT. Everyone keeps saying it but rarely do people think about it. If you sign up for anything and don't study for a year then you're running the risk of the exam or the technology being out dated or retired.

    It this case I'd say no harm done, but there are plenty of TPs out there still advertising MCAD/MCSD and MCDBA on their websites - and I'm waiting for the first person to come along here indignant with rage that they've been studying for 12 months only to be told by the test centre that the exam hasn't been available for two years when they try and sit it. :(
     
    Certifications: MCT, MCTS, i-Net+, CIW CI, Prince2, MSP, MCSD
  6. BosonMichael
    Highly Decorated Member Award

    BosonMichael Yottabyte Poster

    19,136
    462
    374
    Dude... the main reason is because 701/702 study materials aren't available, or if they are, they've JUST been released. :blink Why not just take the 601/602 and be done with it?

    Network+ should indeed be the next step. Unfortunately, Advent sold you a package that was unsuitable for your current experience level.
     
    Certifications: CISSP, MCSE+I, MCSE: Security, MCSE: Messaging, MCDST, MCDBA, MCTS, OCP, CCNP, CCDP, CCNA Security, CCNA Voice, CNE, SCSA, Security+, Linux+, Server+, Network+, A+
    WIP: Just about everything!
  7. Alex399

    Alex399 Byte Poster

    212
    8
    29
    I wasn't aware that the study materials weren't yet available or just been released recentley... I assumed it being 2009 exam they have it released early part of the year, its my bad habit I need to stop assuming :rolleyes:

    About Advent selling me a course unsuitable to my experience you might be surprised to hear that the Preachy sales guy from Advent told me about the work experience I would need to progress from one role to the next, though I think he did understate the amount of experience needed in certin roles to progress further and in his evaluation given 2 years of work experience of varied roles heading up towards a Network/Systems Engineer
    2 years in his mind was a realistic amount of work experience to need for that role but the guy was trying to sell me a course that he surely earns alot of commision for if its successfully sold so I took that into account of course.

    He wasn't understating the experience by a ridiculous margin, perhaps 3 years of work experience for the fast learners to attain Network Engineer status and maybe more if your not so fast at learning IT
     
    WIP: A+, N+, MCP, MCDST
  8. BosonMichael
    Highly Decorated Member Award

    BosonMichael Yottabyte Poster

    19,136
    462
    374
    Yep, the new exams just came online in August.

    Like Jonny said, employers aren't going to care which version you took. Just knock out the 601/602 combo before they retire in February. Don't wait until the last minute...

    You don't need 2 years or 3 years or 5 years of IT experience... you need 1 year of server administration experience in a multi-site, multi-server domain environment. And nobody can tell you how long it's going to take for you to get a year of server administration experience. Might be a year after you get your first IT job... might not happen after 10 years.

    Thus, if you didn't already have the experience, he shouldn't have been selling an MCSE training package to you. Just my experienced opinion.

    Keep in mind that learning doesn't equal experience. The only thing that gives you experience is experience. Doesn't matter how fast you learn.
     
    Certifications: CISSP, MCSE+I, MCSE: Security, MCSE: Messaging, MCDST, MCDBA, MCTS, OCP, CCNP, CCDP, CCNA Security, CCNA Voice, CNE, SCSA, Security+, Linux+, Server+, Network+, A+
    WIP: Just about everything!
  9. Markyboyt

    Markyboyt Kilobyte Poster

    407
    12
    39
    I think the main point here is, if your investing such a large sum of money into something, then make sure you know everything there is to know about it before hand
     
    WIP: A+
  10. JonnyMX

    JonnyMX Petabyte Poster

    5,239
    211
    236
    Yup, that's what I said - but I rambled on a bit...

    :biggrin
     
    Certifications: MCT, MCTS, i-Net+, CIW CI, Prince2, MSP, MCSD
  11. Markyboyt

    Markyboyt Kilobyte Poster

    407
    12
    39
    lol
    Also to add to your post, car salesmen are the same, they only know what it says on the paper or whats fitted to their car, and god that causes some issues, try explaining to a customer that their £30-60K car doesn't do what the salesmen said it would
     
    WIP: A+
  12. Advent Chris

    Advent Chris New Member

    4
    0
    1
    Hi Alex

    As you can guess, I work for Advent, so thought I would give you a quick answer to your questions, although most of this is really just clarifying what other posters have said already.

    The exams for the new A+ only became available in August this year, and there were no training materials or exam software available before this point. We're currently requesting that students complete their existing course, as the exams are not retired until the end of July 2010. As other posters on this thread say, the "old" A+ is still relevant.

    However, if you want to migrate over to the 2009 version, get in touch with your mentor and ask to be moved over. Training materials will be available in December, so we'll get them to you as soon as we can. There's no charge for this - you'll just need to wait for them to arrive.

    Regarding the Network+ exam. No, it's not standard to MCSA, and we don't offer it at the moment.

    Again, if you have any questions about your specific studies, your mentor should be able to help.

    Hope this helps

    Chris @ Advent
     
  13. greenbrucelee
    Highly Decorated Member Award

    greenbrucelee Zettabyte Poster

    14,283
    254
    329
    I have question.

    I am not with Advent or any other TP but can you tell me why places such as your insist on putting people through certifications they have no business doing?

    i.e no one should be doing the mcsa or mcse unless they have required on the job experience.
     
    Certifications: A+, N+, MCDST, Security+, 70-270
    WIP: 70-620 or 70-680?
  14. JonnyMX

    JonnyMX Petabyte Poster

    5,239
    211
    236
    It's a business mate.
    While I wouldn't go as far as to call it unethical, they are simply selling things to people who want to buy them.

    Correct me if I'm wrong, but the dealership doesn't need to see your driving license when you buy a car (or at least they didn't in my day) on the grounds that if you bought a car and couldn't drive it then that was ultimately your problem.

    The issue is with certifications is that although there are recommended levels of experience to reach before taking some exams there is no actual check to ensure that you have the suggested experience prior to sitting the exam. So Microsoft doesn't actually stop any Tom, Dick or Harry from doing an MCSE if they want to, which is why some people get themselves into such a pickle.

    Interestingly enough, I seem to recall that the survey that you do either before or after an exam asks you things like how long you've worked in IT and how you prepared for the exam.

    That means that MS know that there are hundreds of people sitting MCSE exams who have absolutely no IT experience and have covered the material over three months with a TP. But if they choose to do nothing with that information then what can you do?

    :blink
     
    Certifications: MCT, MCTS, i-Net+, CIW CI, Prince2, MSP, MCSD
  15. Alex399

    Alex399 Byte Poster

    212
    8
    29
    That makes it very tempting to wait for the 2009 Comptia exam in december if I can get the updated exam and study materials at no extra cost :p

    In response to Boson the sales guy described to me the work experience is essential to make effective use of the MCSA and MCSE certs being on my CV. The idea being that you get the required job experience inbetween each cert/exam passed to progress onto your next job role, as there is no time limit on the MCSE course with the TP.

    They sell you the exams, study materials and support from the mentors, your not buying a guaranteed job placement for the relevant position to each exam your passing, the sales guy made me aware of the experience I should have once taking the MCSA and MCSE exams, I haven't taken the MCSE or MCSA exams very far from it infact there in the pipeline for me and I really do have my fingers crossed in terms of getting decent on the job experience before taking the exams.

    People are assuming I'm going to plough through the exams just getting them done as quick as possible but nooooooo, I think I study at a pretty slow pace anyway but I do a thorough job of understanding everthing Ive read. I will completely stop inbetween certs if I have to until I find a Job with the right type of hands on experience I will need to fully benifit from the MCSA and MCSE Certifications.

    Advent Chris thank you for your quick response to this thread, so I can take the 2009 version of the Comptia A+ exam come december and logic tells me that you also do the same for MCSE, MCSA, MCDST and MCP exams, as time passes on my course can I receive updated study materials and exams on all the type of certs on my course provided they are available to Advent at the time?????

    If the answer is no then I need to be quick finding an entry level position and a different role further on from that to gain experience prior taking MCSA and MCSE, I fear that if I spend to long getting Job experience that the exams get made redundant or the fact that the older exams/certs to new ones that come out in the future will be alot less attractive to potential employers perhaps?????
     
    WIP: A+, N+, MCP, MCDST
  16. BosonMichael
    Highly Decorated Member Award

    BosonMichael Yottabyte Poster

    19,136
    462
    374
    This. Although I don't agree with the practice of selling MCSE courses to someone without experience, I agree that they should have the right to sell their training if they choose to do so. The training companies are simply providing a service. They believe that they are helping people with their careers, and in some cases, they are.

    Unfortunately, they're very likely hurting those who go into an MCSE course package with aspirations of big bucks, and those dreams typically end up being shattered (with a huge debt to go with it). We've all SEEN what happens to people who get the MCSE without experience. IF the training centers sell this training KNOWING the probable consequences to the careers of those just getting into IT, that practice is rather diabolical, in my opinion.

    You're not going to be able to legislate training companies to do what we believe is the "right thing". That's why we need to continue to lead people down the correct path to a successful IT career. It's a tried and true method, consistently proven to be helpful. Best we can do is to be vocal and hope that people do their research.
     
    Certifications: CISSP, MCSE+I, MCSE: Security, MCSE: Messaging, MCDST, MCDBA, MCTS, OCP, CCNP, CCDP, CCNA Security, CCNA Voice, CNE, SCSA, Security+, Linux+, Server+, Network+, A+
    WIP: Just about everything!
  17. Advent Chris

    Advent Chris New Member

    4
    0
    1
    Hi Alex

    The answer is yes - if the exam has changed and we offer it, you will have the option to upgrade at no extra cost.

    I'll PM you about jobs and work experience, because otherwise this thread will turn into an advert for Advent.

    Chris @ Advent
     
  18. BosonMichael
    Highly Decorated Member Award

    BosonMichael Yottabyte Poster

    19,136
    462
    374
    I assume nothing. I'm simply warning you because we've all seen people plough through the exams and come to figure out that they probably shouldn't have done that.

    Good plan.

    Yep... you need to be looking for one now. :)

    Well, now you're starting to see some of the reasons why you shouldn't buy a bunch of courses in advance. There's no guarantee when or if you'll get to the point in your career where you'll be ready for the MCSE. Many people find out that IT is really not for them and give up, yet they're still saddled with the course debt. I'm not saying that that'll happen to you; I simply warn you of what COULD happen.

    The MCSE will ALWAYS be attractive to potential employers. Just because I have the MCSE on NT 4.0 doesn't mean that that certification is useless now... in fact, it rightfully shows that I've been in IT for a while. Trust me, having the MCSE on NT 4, the MCSE on 2000, *and* the MCSE on 2003 looks a LOT better than just having the MCSE on 2003.
     
    Certifications: CISSP, MCSE+I, MCSE: Security, MCSE: Messaging, MCDST, MCDBA, MCTS, OCP, CCNP, CCDP, CCNA Security, CCNA Voice, CNE, SCSA, Security+, Linux+, Server+, Network+, A+
    WIP: Just about everything!
  19. Alex399

    Alex399 Byte Poster

    212
    8
    29
    This thread has been alot of help to me guys thank you for your input and a big thank you to BosonMichael and Greenbruce lee and all the others, you guys really do know your stuff 8) I really appreciate your advice, thank you :D

    On a side note, in your opinion should I wait for the Comptia A+ exam 2009 in December opposed to taking the Comptia A+ 2006 version to come in December??? or does it really not make enough difference to be worth waiting for? remember I wouldn't be paying anything extra to then take the new exam coming out in december

    I'm a bit puzzled as to if I should wait or just take the current 2006 exam and I could still read through the Mike Meyers A+ essentials book I have at present of course anyway If I wait the 2 months
     
    WIP: A+, N+, MCP, MCDST
  20. JonnyMX

    JonnyMX Petabyte Poster

    5,239
    211
    236
    As I said before, your CV will say 'A+ Certified' whichever one you take.
    There's nothing wrong with the 2006 version, and if you're part way through - keep going.
    Just make sure you plan your studies to get both exams done before they retire.

    The good thing about the 2006 A+ is that it's been around a while so there are plenty of resources for it and plenty of places to look for help.
    If you opt for 2009, you may find it a while before a decent selection of training material and practice exams start to come through.
     
    Certifications: MCT, MCTS, i-Net+, CIW CI, Prince2, MSP, MCSD

Share This Page

Loading...